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Media => Single-Player RPGs => Topic started by: Lard on February 21, 2012, 09:29:29 PM

Title: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Lard on February 21, 2012, 09:29:29 PM
Not a huge surprise but I'm glad nonetheless

http://www.siliconera.com/2012/02/21/etrian-odyssey-iv-sailing-to-3ds-with-more-approachable-casual-difficulty-level/
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Yggdrasil on February 21, 2012, 10:22:23 PM
With any luck this might be the first game I play of the series, should get a 3DS first.

Though, I would really love to see another album like the "Live Music by Piano and Strings" that the did a while back. To this day is pretty much my favorite video game music album thing ever (example (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7gdz3PKz6-4)).
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Hathen on February 22, 2012, 09:45:23 AM
I'm glad they're adding the more casual difficulty level.

I actually really like the character/class customization of the games, I just never get that far in them because I get frustrated with the pacing of the game.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Fadedsun on February 22, 2012, 09:45:53 AM
Scans! http://nintendoeverything.com/83158/first-etrian-odyssey-iv-scans/
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: PotRoast on February 22, 2012, 10:08:33 AM
I am about halfway through EOIII. Given I just beat Radiant Historia last night, I guess this announcement is saying I should go back and work on EOIII some more instead of moving on to a new game.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: cj_iwakura on February 22, 2012, 10:12:16 AM
Hoping they finally get animated sprites, like was rumored since EO2(and actually happened in SMT: EO-... I mean Strange Journey).
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: cj_iwakura on February 22, 2012, 10:46:12 AM
http://andriasang.com/con02c/etrian_odyssey_iv_screens/

Yep. Animated!
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Fadedsun on February 22, 2012, 10:52:52 AM
Wish the enemies were still 2D sprites, though. Oh well. I'm still going to love the game anyway.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: TurnBasedDude on February 22, 2012, 11:09:53 AM
Not long ago, I recently replayed and beaten the first game, and been playing the second one until Abyss came out. I am certainly stoked for this.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Raze on February 22, 2012, 12:48:20 PM
Soon...

(http://i43.tinypic.com/11hewz7.jpg)
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Fadedsun on February 22, 2012, 01:28:52 PM
^^ F.O.E! F.O.E!
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Draak on February 22, 2012, 02:55:28 PM
^^^ Haha, I thought I was the only who noticed the similarity to Ragelope!

I wonder if you'll be able to fly around the dungeons you are about to explore or if it will be the same as with sailing in EO3. Would be cool if you had to fly in a balloon to reach a new stratum.

Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Fadedsun on February 22, 2012, 03:20:35 PM
^^^ Haha, I thought I was the only who noticed the similarity to Ragelope!

I wonder if you'll be able to fly around the dungeons you are about to explore or if it will be the same as with sailing in EO3. Would be cool if you had to fly in a balloon to reach a new stratum.



That would be really cool, and would add to the feeling of exploration that the game has. It would be a neat idea if you had to actually find the next stratum by flying the balloon around instead of just reaching the stairs at the end of the previous stratum.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Lard on February 22, 2012, 04:02:26 PM
What other RPGs are out right now for the 3DS right now?

Devil Survivor and......?




Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Fadedsun on February 22, 2012, 04:13:29 PM
What other RPGs are out right now for the 3DS right now?

Devil Survivor and......?






Tales of the Abyss if you count the European release, but yeah that's it as far as I know.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Mickeymac92 on February 23, 2012, 10:13:58 PM
Actually, Tales of the Abyss 3D has been out in the US for about a week now...yeah, I missed it, too. And it's sold out.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Nel_Annette on February 24, 2012, 02:54:27 AM
*claps*

Yes! I love EO3, and I actually ordered the first two recently, so this is very welcome news.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Farron on February 24, 2012, 01:31:19 PM
I don't want to feel like the party popper but I do have a genuine question for Etrian Odyssey fans.
What makes this series good in say comparison to other grindy RPGs ?

When EOII, if I'm not mistaken, was released I looked it up and all and thought it might be good but then I found out it has a kick in the nuts difficulty, areas that are more like mazes and correct me if I'm wrong but high encounter rate, right ?

Sure there are a lot a people who enjoy a good classic style RPG, I do so myself, sometimes, but reason such as those were the ones that made me (in a way) not like a game that remembers me of EO, SMT: Strange Journey.

So, I'm all for opinion because if it's good I'd like to at least try it out!
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Fadedsun on February 24, 2012, 01:46:59 PM
I don't want to feel like the party popper but I do have a genuine question for Etrian Odyssey fans.
What makes this series good in say comparison to other grindy RPGs ?

Maybe the first two EO were more grindy, but with EOIII you didn't really need to grind. As you progressed thru the floors, your characters would level up enough that you would never really have to grind. The only reason I would grind is if I had rested or retired a character and needed to level him up to the rest of my party.

I think people make the series to be more difficult than it actually is. The real difficulty hits later on in the post game when you try to tackle the more difficult boss battles.

For me, I just love exploring the dungeon, and customizing my party and trying to think of new ways to play the game that I hadn't before. You don't have to play with the max amount of party members, and you can make different builds for your characters making the experience different.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Fadedsun on February 24, 2012, 01:49:11 PM
I don't want to feel like the party popper but I do have a genuine question for Etrian Odyssey fans.
What makes this series good in say comparison to other grindy RPGs ?

Maybe the first two EO were more grindy, but with EOIII you didn't really need to grind. As you progressed thru the floors, your characters would level up enough that you would never really have to grind. The only reason I would grind is if I had rested or retired a character and needed to level him up to the rest of my party. Oh, and especially in EOIII, if you did all the quests on each floor, you would gain a lot of experience points for your party from that. There was other tricks to grinding(if you needed to) that utilized sea boss exploits, too.

I think people make the series to be more difficult than it actually is. The real difficulty hits later on in the post game when you try to tackle the more difficult boss battles.

For me, I just love exploring the dungeon, and customizing my party and trying to think of new ways to play the game that I hadn't before. You don't have to play with the max amount of party members, and you can make different builds for your characters making the experience different.

I don't know why this posted twice and I don't know how to delete posts. Help?
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Nel_Annette on February 24, 2012, 01:53:49 PM
In addition to what Fadedsun said, I love the soundtracks to this series and the artwork is really pretty too. EO3 pre-order artbook ftw.

It's just a fun series to waste time with when I can't think of anything else to play.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Lard on February 24, 2012, 04:09:11 PM
I don't want to feel like the party popper but I do have a genuine question for Etrian Odyssey fans.
What makes this series good in say comparison to other grindy RPGs ?

When EOII, if I'm not mistaken, was released I looked it up and all and thought it might be good but then I found out it has a kick in the nuts difficulty, areas that are more like mazes and correct me if I'm wrong but high encounter rate, right ?

Sure there are a lot a people who enjoy a good classic style RPG, I do so myself, sometimes, but reason such as those were the ones that made me (in a way) not like a game that remembers me of EO, SMT: Strange Journey.

So, I'm all for opinion because if it's good I'd like to at least try it out!

For me, part of the reason I like it is admittedly out of nostalgia.

It reminds me of being a kid and playing the Bard's Tale on the C64. It's a very deliberate old school throwback and there's not much else out there like it. It's fun to have something like that. Also, the gameplay mechanics and battle system are straight forward and easy to use and it's pretty easy to pick up and learn how to play.

Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Starmongoose on February 24, 2012, 09:10:43 PM
I never played those sorts of RPGs as a child but I still love EO.


Ill explain in a sec, queuing for Leauge of Legends.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Aurian on February 25, 2012, 12:07:17 AM
Its also kinda fun how they designed EO3 to have YOU have the option to draw your own map (as opposed to not having one) on the touchscreen.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Fadedsun on February 25, 2012, 01:05:50 AM
Its also kinda fun how they designed EO3 to have YOU have the option to draw your own map (as opposed to not having one) on the touchscreen.

I've thought of replaying the game again, but not drawing the map just to make it harder. Then I realized that would take FOR-EV-ER and decided not to.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Draak on February 25, 2012, 04:01:24 PM
The EO series is pure gameplay goodness, without a dumb plot or drama filled characters dragging things down. It's simple, no nonsense. Exploring and mapping floors is also fun. I'm not satisfied until I fall into every hole, haha.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Themadcow on February 27, 2012, 08:12:02 AM
Great news. I just hope that NOE continues it's good work recently and brings it to the UK. Neither EO2 or 3 made it to Europe but it wasn't a problem due to the DS being region free. It really was a crappy move to make the 3DS region locked...

This and Fire Emblem announced in the same week. It's like Christmas, except better.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Fadedsun on February 27, 2012, 01:19:10 PM
Official site is open with some great music!

http://sq4.atlusnet.jp/

 A short article about it from Andriasang: http://andriasang.com/con03y/etrian_odyssey_site/
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Yggdrasil on February 27, 2012, 01:53:27 PM
"One reason [for the inclusion of casual mode] is to allow the game to be enjoyed by players who may be busy or have not played the series before or those who just want to enjoy the dungeon exploration and map drawing component.

The other reason is that the inclusion of casual mode will allow the staff to increase the difficulty of normal mode without worries."


This is excellent news.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Matrix on March 03, 2012, 12:00:46 AM
i see no issue with a casual mode.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Eusis on March 03, 2012, 12:10:08 AM
I think the only reason to be concerned is if you felt the difficulty hit a sweet spot as it is, but now you have to choose between too easy, or too hard. I'm not too concerned admittedly, I go into the series expecting to be throttled, though if it sounds unfair I'd probably stick with casual.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Matrix on March 03, 2012, 12:13:23 AM
Just like fire emblem when nintendo added a casual mode, its just a way to appeal to gamers who might not be up to the challenge.

The reason its an option is they dont want to get rid of the hardcore aspect
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Yggdrasil on March 03, 2012, 12:27:33 AM
I just want to enjoy the exploration and music. :3

And after finishing the game once on casual mode I'll be ready to get my butt kicked on normal mode!

But, how hard is Etrian Odyssey? I've read before that is way easier than the older Wizardry games but others say that EO can get pretty crazy at times. I have never touched any of the Wizardry games and Etrian Odyssey IV is going to be the first I'll try, so it could be nice to know.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Eusis on March 03, 2012, 12:31:43 AM
Just like fire emblem when nintendo added a casual mode, its just a way to appeal to gamers who might not be up to the challenge.

The reason its an option is they dont want to get rid of the hardcore aspect

They've actually said that this allows them to not hold back as much now that people who don't want a hard time can just play on casual mode. So no, this isn't going to be a case where people who were happy as it is are necessarily going to be content.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Matrix on March 03, 2012, 06:31:25 AM
I just want to enjoy the exploration and music. :3

And after finishing the game once on casual mode I'll be ready to get my butt kicked on normal mode!

But, how hard is Etrian Odyssey? I've read before that is way easier than the older Wizardry games but others say that EO can get pretty crazy at times. I have never touched any of the Wizardry games and Etrian Odyssey IV is going to be the first I'll try, so it could be nice to know.

@eusis, i havent seen one person unhappy with the new fire emblem yet

@yggd

Depends. Certain parts of the game can hit a 10 on the difficulty scale if you dont have the right party set up, items, strategy, ect


At other parts its a 6
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Eusis on March 04, 2012, 12:07:05 AM
@eusis, i havent seen one person unhappy with the new fire emblem yet

That was in reference to Etrian Odyssey IV, I don't recall hearing if FE throwing in a casual mode had the alternative purpose of allowing them to make the main game harder. THAT, and you're not going to hear as many opinions on how it effected the non-casual mode for FE simply because they didn't localize it (funny, casual mode was part of why I was interested in that installment, only for Nintendo to skip on localizing once again.)
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Matrix on March 04, 2012, 06:30:01 AM
they didnt localize it for who knows what reason.  I imported
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Fadedsun on March 05, 2012, 11:51:05 AM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oaiy2B5H-64&feature=player_embedded

The 3D models look good in action!
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Matrix on March 05, 2012, 12:47:18 PM
i prefer sprites myself but IV is better than nothing
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Yggdrasil on March 05, 2012, 01:13:09 PM
This deal of getting excited because the enemies have animation now is not something that happened first with Phantasy Star in the 80's?

I remember hearing a podcast of how amazing the animation of the enemies were on Phantasy Star on the Master System compared to Dragon Warrion on the NES.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Matrix on March 05, 2012, 03:06:29 PM
well this is an old school series
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Fadedsun on March 19, 2012, 02:37:06 PM
Monster animations are looking pretty good in 3D.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=key_TnHb7WQ&feature=player_embedded
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Themadcow on March 20, 2012, 06:05:53 AM
Meh, I'll be very very unhappy if this doesn't come out in Europe (like EO2 and EO3). The reason I bought my 3DS was because I could import EO2 and 3 from the US but it isn't an option with 4.

Half the fun with EO3 was coming up with gamechanging sub-class builds so I'll be interested in seeing how they deal with it in 4.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Yggdrasil on August 02, 2012, 08:01:51 PM
Labyrinth I - Cerulean Woodlands (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eTU-jTmWr-k)
Minor Labyrinth I - The Undiscovered Realm (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDJgOre1nhw)

Yuzo Koshiro did it again.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Mickeymac92 on August 02, 2012, 08:43:55 PM
I remember hearing a podcast of how amazing the animation of the enemies were on Phantasy Star on the Master System compared to Dragon Warrion on the NES.

I remember being amazed by Phantasy Star's animations back in 2010. :P (Granted I played it not long after playing Dragon Warrior for the NES) They were pretty good considering its age, IIRC.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Draak on August 02, 2012, 09:13:12 PM
Labyrinth I - Cerulean Woodlands (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eTU-jTmWr-k)
Minor Labyrinth I - The Undiscovered Realm (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDJgOre1nhw)

Yuzo Koshiro did it again.

The OST is better than the EOIII one, "Battlefield - Storm (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PCZjnuS6ESc)" is fucking awesome. Can't wait for the Super Arrange album.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Mickeymac92 on August 04, 2012, 03:18:02 PM
Labyrinth I - Cerulean Woodlands (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eTU-jTmWr-k)
Minor Labyrinth I - The Undiscovered Realm (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MDJgOre1nhw)

Yuzo Koshiro did it again.

Wow, that was pretty great. Now I'm inspired to play my copy of Etrian Odyssey III again (I know it's from 4 but that's not out yet. =P)
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Taelus on August 06, 2012, 12:04:04 AM
I love this series. I'm listening to the OST  for IV, and it's just all sorts of awesome. I feel pretty confident we'll get a localization.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Lard on November 21, 2012, 07:34:18 PM
http://nintendoeverything.com/106388/etrian-odyssey-iv-dated-for-north-america-bonus-items-for-early-buyers/

Feb 26th for North America
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Taelus on November 21, 2012, 07:45:31 PM
I believe I speak for us all when I say:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1D1cap6yETA
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Desert Walker on November 28, 2012, 10:42:00 PM
Pre-ordered.  Also, this will give me an excuse to get around to Etrian Odyssey III some time soon.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Desert Walker on December 21, 2012, 08:49:09 AM
Medic (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iUt1oRutEVw&feature=youtu.be) and Landsknecht (http://www.youtube.com/watch?NR=1&feature=endscreen&v=3zn2iFzUaAg) class trailers.

I'm really liking that the medic class combines healer and farmer/ranger/scavenger classes together and does so in a logical way.  Definitely going to have one on my team.  I also appreciate that you have a choice of fantasy-style/school girl or modern scientist/doctor look.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Mickeymac92 on December 21, 2012, 11:58:59 AM
Pre-ordered.  Also, this will give me an excuse to get around to Etrian Odyssey III some time soon.

If you manage to finish it on time, think you could give me a total time estimate? I'm on the first floor of the second stratum, and it felt like it took 20 hours just to get through the first Stratum (granted 5+ hours were just sailing), and it doesn't seem like it'll get any quicker.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Nel_Annette on December 24, 2012, 09:52:20 PM
I'm only on the second floor of the first game still, and I started that earlier this year. XD Succeeding feels like it takes forever.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Desert Walker on January 23, 2013, 09:43:16 AM
According to Atlus they're putting up a free demo on the 3DS eShop Feb 7th and that the demo will function as a save point for the full game if you choose to buy it.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Starmongoose on January 23, 2013, 09:52:56 AM
Guys, this years RPGFan statistics are in!  I thought I would share them with you guys.

(http://i481.photobucket.com/albums/rr174/Starmongoose/Statistics_zpsd7c5424d.png)
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Akanbe- on January 23, 2013, 05:15:02 PM
^lol. 

According to Atlus they're putting up a free demo on the 3DS eShop Feb 7th and that the demo will function as a save point for the full game if you choose to buy it.

I don't really like dungeon crawlers and am making an exception for Soul Hackers, but EO might be interesting.  Gonna wait for the review regardless, but good to know there's a demo that can help confirm feelings and not waste any time invested.  If only Tales of Hearts R demo had that feature. That guy who poured close to 80 hours into the demo would be happier I imagine.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Cyril on January 23, 2013, 05:57:17 PM
If you don't like first-person dungeon crawlers, you won't like EO.  It's an easier Wizardry with eastern, lighter-colored designs instead of western, darker designs.

That's not to say it's bad, mind you, simply that it probably isn't going to be something you enjoy.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Akanbe- on January 23, 2013, 06:00:34 PM
Truly, I've never really played many.  I think I more or less don't like the idea of them.  It just depends on how the story is delivered.  Also, class base combat is usually something I like.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Cyril on January 23, 2013, 06:10:36 PM
I admittedly don't know about IV because I haven't played it, but I-III were light when it comes to the story, not much more than the average game in the genre.  I think you might be getting fooled by the artstyle or its publisher/developer; the story is really just there to give a reason for the dungeon and its enemies inside to exist.  It's all about the gameplay.

Of recently-released first-person dungeon crawlers, Unchained Blades had the most story to it.  That particular game has so much story to it that I actually wanted it to be quiet and let me just go through my dungeons.

But, absolutely, try the demo.  You might find you enjoy the genre more than you'd expect.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Eusis on January 23, 2013, 06:55:27 PM
The story's pretty much in line with what you'd expect of an RPG from the 80s I'd say: there can be some solid moments, and likely a shocking twist or two, but it's hardly the focus. You play because you enjoy dungeon crawling, if you don't want that you'd be better off playing a more cinematically driven RPG, or whatever it is that strikes your fancy.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Farron on January 23, 2013, 09:56:02 PM
From the bunch I played of EO3 I found the lack of story was one point against the game for me. Still, I did manage to have fun with the game but I think it needs too much grinding and it gives very little in the form of reward (which many times can be a story), so as much as I wanted to support this game and give it a go, I'll probably wait more to see people's reactions on it. In the meantime I'm putting my chances on a genre of RPG which I'm much more inclined to like, Fire Emblem: Awakening.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Taelus on January 23, 2013, 11:58:39 PM
From the bunch I played of EO3 I found the lack of story was one point against the game for me. Still, I did manage to have fun with the game but I think it needs too much grinding and it gives very little in the form of reward (which many times can be a story), so as much as I wanted to support this game and give it a go, I'll probably wait more to see people's reactions on it. In the meantime I'm putting my chances on a genre of RPG which I'm much more inclined to like, Fire Emblem: Awakening.

The game is basically EO1-2-3 with polygonal enemies and live instrumentation in its music. Which I think is awesome, but if you're looking for more emphasis on plot, you may have to look elsewhere.

AND ADVENTURE IS ITS OWN REWARD!
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Desert Walker on February 01, 2013, 08:46:35 PM
Guys, this years RPGFan statistics are in!  I thought I would share them with you guys.

(http://i481.photobucket.com/albums/rr174/Starmongoose/Statistics_zpsd7c5424d.png)

The forum is so awesome that it causes one to forget about the main site.  That's my story and I'm sticking to it!
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Starmongoose on February 01, 2013, 08:50:51 PM
A likely story.

The Runemaster class looks pretty much like the Zodiac and whatever they were called before that. I guess there really isn't many ways you can present a master of the elements.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Taelus on February 01, 2013, 08:52:03 PM
Taelus as a character is always a mage. Looks like this time around, he'll be Taelus the Runemaster.

RUNEMASTAR
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Raze on February 01, 2013, 11:22:03 PM
The Runemaster class looks pretty much like the Zodiac and whatever they were called before that. I guess there really isn't many ways you can present a master of the elements.

I was never a fan of EO mages on their own. and the calculator http://crazyuncleivans.com/eo4skillsim/EO4Skillsim.html (http://crazyuncleivans.com/eo4skillsim/EO4Skillsim.html) makes them look like the usual, which is to say, like bringing a sprinter to a marathon. It's up to the subjob to save them and on that note a samurai sub looks like it might be interesting with calm to recover tp. And you get a auto res, a dispel and you can keep rage up for foes and bosses. All for 5 points.

I want to make a mage work this time, because I want a sleepy runemaster.

Subbing samurai, originally beastman, must be a pain though. You probably have to make one of them bite you or something.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Taelus on February 01, 2013, 11:35:52 PM
Well, I found that pretty often I'd save my mages MP for tougher monsters and let the rest of my party do the gruntwork. Same method I used in Phantasy Star IV and classic RPGs, too. I love me some magic. Though it DOES suck when they run dry and you're like 'welp.'
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Eusis on February 07, 2013, 01:35:17 AM
Demo's out ahead of time, search for it in the store.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Raze on February 07, 2013, 09:37:41 AM
Well, I found that pretty often I'd save my mages MP for tougher monsters and let the rest of my party do the gruntwork. Same method I used in Phantasy Star IV and classic RPGs, too. I love me some magic. Though it DOES suck when they run dry and you're like 'welp.'

You shouldn't need to do that in PS4. Rune won't ever run out of juice, to the point that people give him two shields because he'll always be able to cast SOMETHING and doesn't need a normal attack.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Taelus on February 07, 2013, 09:47:38 AM
Well, I found that pretty often I'd save my mages MP for tougher monsters and let the rest of my party do the gruntwork. Same method I used in Phantasy Star IV and classic RPGs, too. I love me some magic. Though it DOES suck when they run dry and you're like 'welp.'

You shouldn't need to do that in PS4. Rune won't ever run out of juice, to the point that people give him two shields because he'll always be able to cast SOMETHING and doesn't need a normal attack.

I've beaten PSIV like a zillion times. I dual-shield Rune, and usually use my skills for regular fights (other than the big stuff), but I almost always save my MP. Whether I need to or not isn't really what I was getting it, it's that I just like to do that. Plus, I was being diplomatic :). Once you have Raja you can use Ataraxia and restore TP anyway.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: kyuusei on February 07, 2013, 03:08:03 PM
Back to EO4.. has anyone actually tried the demo yet?
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Taelus on February 07, 2013, 04:17:08 PM
I have. The music is awesome, and it's quite an extensive demo-- I'm very impressed with it. The new graphical overhaul keeps the same style but manages to make it very fresh.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Eusis on February 07, 2013, 04:19:23 PM
Back to EO4.. has anyone actually tried the demo yet?

I did a bit last night, enough to get to the overworld. It's more EO, but the mechanic of flying around the map to visit dungeons is a refreshing twist and not like EOIII's ship thing that was more like a puzzle game to get you EXP/cash on the side. Basically introducing an overworld to the game, but in a way that comes off as more oldschool. I appreciate too that despite introducing 3D graphics they DIDN'T slow combat down at all, that's something that's historically slowed down quite a few games when transitioning from 2D to 3D, though Atlus had been good about keeping MegaTen speedy anyway. I also kind of appreciate how they streamlined the classes, 7 available at the offset this time rather than 10.

Sound quality's kind of crap though, but they said it will be better in the full game, and I'm disappointed at how 3D's not properly used in the dungeons. Seems dungeon graphics are a flat plane with stuff like the HUD being another plane.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Starmongoose on February 07, 2013, 05:34:31 PM
I love this demo, compared to the Fire Emblem demo I feel like I'm really getting a lot out of it. I agree with Eusis, I prefer the Airship to the Boat any day. In EOIII i never even bothered trying to do it because it was so frustrating.

Not much I can say, I'll definitely be picking this up. The music is just great, filling in my map with that music playing is just so peaceful. The skill system looks better, though I can't really judge it properly till later in the game when skills get all combo-y and synergy-y.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Fadedsun on February 07, 2013, 06:08:47 PM
Will be downloading the demo shortly. I've been anticipating this game for a while, and it looks to be the best entry in the series so far. It seems each entry improves on the last anyway. Can't wait to play it!
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Starmongoose on February 07, 2013, 10:58:43 PM
From John's news story:

"And although it won't be in the demo, keep your eyes peeled to RPGFan if you snag the full version of the game - we'll have a little surprise for you."

Heh heh heh.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Taelus on February 07, 2013, 11:41:28 PM
Oh, it'll be a surprise all right.

Also I love this game. Love how it's more accessible in the first area for newcomers, but quickly ramps it up. Love the changes to gathering and equipment buying, love the overworlds. Great work, all around here.

The only thing I miss are the BIG RED LIGHTS for FOEs since it made them more mysterious and the FM synthesizer battle themes, because Yuzo Koshiro's bass makes me feel pretty.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Fadedsun on February 08, 2013, 09:20:46 AM
I love it already (not that I had any doubts). I don't hear anything wrong with the music in the demo, though.

Not sure if you can adjust the controls, but I'd much rather control movement with the circle pad, and the map with the d-pad. It feels more comfortable that way, because the map comes secondary to moving your character.

I'm not digging the characters portraits as much this time around; mostly the Fortress portraits.

I love that they finally included a real skill tree and more detailed descriptions of the skills. 
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Starmongoose on February 08, 2013, 09:26:18 AM
It might just be me, but when you complete a quest the "Complete!!" music plays, but it cuts short before the animation is complete so I'm left looking at the "Complete!!" screen in silence for about a second. It just feels a bit clunky.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Farron on February 08, 2013, 11:42:36 AM
I gotta give it to Atlus this time I tried the demo today just for the sake of trying and I can't believe how surprised I was!
I did have some experience with EOIII and while I liked some of it, I did have my gripes with other things like the learning curve, difficulty, XP rate, etc.

This one, however, I'm liking way more than the other. There are some measures of the strengh of FOEs on the map, also the possibility to know which creature you'll face. The casual mode is also very welcome as I hated that the game was already super hard and a little too much meant complete waste.

Now the star of the show here, for me, is the soundtrack. I had no idea it was going to be this good. I did hear people on GameFaqs talk about, and when I entered the game, nothing special, until you go to the dungeon, I was just mesmerized. I literally went to get my high end headphones just to experience the music!

Soundtracks like this, Dragon Quest VIII, Ni no Kuni, are what can make me smile even when I have to grind for hours. What in most games would be a bore, in these, I can't get mad listening to these spectacular songs!
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Taelus on February 08, 2013, 12:24:40 PM
I gotta give it to Atlus this time I tried the demo today just for the sake of trying and I can't believe how surprised I was!
I did have some experience with EOIII and while I liked some of it, I did have my gripes with other things like the learning curve, difficulty, XP rate, etc.

This one, however, I'm liking way more than the other. There are some measures of the strengh of FOEs on the map, also the possibility to know which creature you'll face. The casual mode is also very welcome as I hated that the game was already super hard and a little too much meant complete waste.

Now the star of the show here, for me, is the soundtrack. I had no idea it was going to be this good. I did hear people on GameFaqs talk about, and when I entered the game, nothing special, until you go to the dungeon, I was just mesmerized. I literally went to get my high end headphones just to experience the music!

Soundtracks like this, Dragon Quest VIII, Ni no Kuni, are what can make me smile even when I have to grind for hours. What in most games would be a bore, in these, I can't get mad listening to these spectacular songs!

We've also been saying how great it is, since we reviewed it last year, featured it in our Music of the Year writeup, and our Music of the Year podcast ^^ :) It is indeed fantastic music-- some of Koshiro's best work to date, which is a pretty bold claim, I think.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Solstafir on February 09, 2013, 01:35:34 AM
I bought a lovely purple 3DS today and just finished playing through the demo. Everyone was level 7 by the time I got to the stairs down. I definitely dig the improvements from Etrian Odyssey 2, which was the last one that I played. Otherwise, it's the same good stuff that I was expecting in all sectors. I'll very likely be purchasing this once it comes out. I really appreciate how demo progress will carry over, too. Very well done demo.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Eusis on February 09, 2013, 02:44:17 PM
I noticed I sunk 3 hours into the demo. And I really want more. Now whether to try taking on FOEs, booting back up EO2 or 3, or just wait until 4 hits...
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Starmongoose on February 09, 2013, 02:47:35 PM
I noticed I sunk 3 hours into the demo. And I really want more. Now whether to try taking on FOEs, booting back up EO2 or 3, or just wait until 4 hits...

Same dilemma as me, Eusis. Though Fire Emblem is coming on Monday so in truth I shouldn't start anything.


The demo was so good though, I really need an EO fix.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Fadedsun on February 09, 2013, 04:48:15 PM
I also played the demo like I was playing the full game. When I got to the stairs on the 1st floor and they told me the demo had ended I was like, "Wait. What? But I want to keep playing." The wait for the full game is going to be rough. I had a blast. Best entry in the series yet.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Solstafir on February 09, 2013, 08:16:23 PM
I share you guys' pain :( I put a nice ~4 hours or so into it. Not exactly sure how much because of leaving it idle on and off for a bit. But yeah, really looking forward to the full game now. Few weeks away, bleh!
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Fadedsun on February 12, 2013, 04:28:12 PM
Atlus has two more QR gifts on their Facebook page, as well as one on their Twitter page.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: John on February 26, 2013, 09:55:13 AM
Hey, this is out today!  Also, you can get access to an RPGFan-exclusive quest in the game.

Deets here: http://www.rpgfan.com/news/2013/1130.html
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Starmongoose on February 26, 2013, 09:57:36 AM
Hey, this is out today!  Also, you can get access to an RPGFan-exclusive quest in the game.

Deets here: http://www.rpgfan.com/news/2013/1130.html

I've been so excited about this! Glad we can reveal it now. :D

Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Fadedsun on February 26, 2013, 10:28:24 AM
This is awesome! Congrats RPGfan. I can't wait to try it out once I get the game.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Mickeymac92 on February 26, 2013, 03:49:50 PM
^Same here. I'm really impressed and I can't wait.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Klyde Chroma on February 27, 2013, 04:41:09 PM
Hey, this is out today!  Also, you can get access to an RPGFan-exclusive quest in the game.

Deets here: http://www.rpgfan.com/news/2013/1130.html

I was actually gonna skip EO IV until I saw this..... I never played the other EO titles and dungeon crawlers usually are not my thing.... but an RPGFan exclusive quest!!??? HOW FREAKIN' COOL!!!! So I couldn't help myself.... rent may be due in 2 days, but I had to pick up the LE of this yesterday.... now if I could just find the wherewithal to meander my way through the rest of Fire Emblem.... In truth I really wanna give up on FE as it is effectively boring the hell out of me at this point.........
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Lard on February 27, 2013, 07:55:42 PM
So how long is the QR code going to be up for?

I'm going to order the game this week, but won't be able to play it until July at the earliest.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Eusis on February 27, 2013, 07:59:59 PM
While I can't speak for the website on the whole, I really don't see any rational reason to pull the news story or the image.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Lard on February 27, 2013, 08:13:39 PM
Just checking, thanks.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: John on February 27, 2013, 09:24:52 PM
So how long is the QR code going to be up for?

I'm going to order the game this week, but won't be able to play it until July at the earliest.

As long as I can pay for the server.  So pretty much forever.  It's also located on the EO4 pictures page.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Nel_Annette on February 28, 2013, 03:51:50 PM
Just got my copy in the mail! And I'm so surprised that you guys have an exclusive quest. That's awesome!
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Fadedsun on February 28, 2013, 04:56:50 PM
Just got my copy in the mail! And I'm so surprised that you guys have an exclusive quest. That's awesome!

A few sites have them I've seen. Destructoid has one and so does RPGamer (but we don't care about THEM!).
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: John on February 28, 2013, 05:28:20 PM
One of the RPGamer codes gives a nice early weapon.  You want to scan that one!
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Nel_Annette on February 28, 2013, 10:11:34 PM
Thanks for the heads up, guys. Gotta scan'em all, I guess. I still haven't finished EO1, let alone 2 and 3, but I might just hop into this one.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Fadedsun on March 01, 2013, 09:25:54 AM
This game is so GOOD! The improvements upon EO3 are fantastic.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Raze on March 01, 2013, 11:04:34 AM
 I read that when you unlock a class
Code: [Select]
you get one preleveled. Which pretty much  solves my one worry about the game, being locked to the original classes because it'd be too much a pain to level new ones like it was in 1 and 3.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: John on March 01, 2013, 02:14:11 PM
Just unlocked the RPGFan quest.  It says I should be level 24, but my level 22 guys are going to rock this!
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Taelus on March 01, 2013, 02:30:08 PM
Shiny FOES await you, John-san.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: John on March 01, 2013, 02:31:12 PM
Yeah, actually our quest spawned two shiny FOEs for me.  Ended up getting my level 22 guys to 24 in two battles.  Quest was nice and I got congratulations from a man named "Greene Shield".  Hm, what looks like a green shield...?
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Fadedsun on March 01, 2013, 02:34:17 PM
Just unlocked the RPGFan quest.  It says I should be level 24, but my level 22 guys are going to rock this!

Level 22 already?! I'm slacking. What team are you running? My guys are level 11 currently and my team is Fortress/Nightseeker/Medic in the front and Sniper/Runemaster in the back. When I unlock it,I'm retiring my Runemaster into an Arcanist and subclassing with Runemaster.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: John on March 01, 2013, 02:42:59 PM
Just unlocked the RPGFan quest.  It says I should be level 24, but my level 22 guys are going to rock this!

Level 22 already?! I'm slacking. What team are you running? My guys are level 11 currently and my team is Fortress/Nightseeker/Medic in the front and Sniper/Runemaster in the back. When I unlock it,I'm retiring my Runemaster into an Arcanist and subclassing with Runemaster.

I should note that I'm playing on Casual because I don't have the time to grind for two hours then lose all of that progress because I get critical'd, so my progress is going to be quicker than someone playing on normal.

I'm actually running without a healer, with pretty much my Fortress doing nothing but healing himself.

Front: Landsknecht-Nightseeker-Fortress
Back: Sniper/Runemaster

I like all of my guys but my sniper. The binding stuff hasn't been particularly effective or useful thus far.  I'd swap him out for a Medic, but then I'd have to grind him up.

Edit: I'm digging EO4 much more than any other entry in the series I've played.  Casual mode is great, and I don't feel like I'm lost looking for objectives like I do in many other dungeon crawlers.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Fadedsun on March 01, 2013, 02:50:04 PM
I'm finding my Sniper to be invaluable at the moment with her binding abilities. She's saved me with leg and arm binds in some FOE battles so far. Plus, she's useful for taking out enemies hiding in the back row before they have a chance to make it to the front.

Same here. I'm finding this is the best entry in the series so far. Then again, each subsequent game in the series seems to be better than the last. I'm liking the return to more basic classes. While I liked Etrian Odyssey 3, some of class ideas and skills were a lot to handle and plan out.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Farron on March 01, 2013, 04:33:10 PM
 Boy, I'm so jelaous. My game has been shipped, even a few days before release, but I still have no idea how long it should take to arrive here. So, as I wait I'm still playing tthe demo.

So, you guys with the full game, would you think it is better to grind for some money (in the demo) or there is sometning else I should be doing that would be more productive once my game arrives?

I read some page son gamefaqs about the pookas but I just can't seem to understand how they move, how to throw food at them or anything. All I know is they drop an item that increases your stats.

As for party, my main is Landsknecht/fortress/nightseeker in front and sniper/healer in the back.
It is doing fine in the dungeon but I feel like the nightseeker isn't being all that usefull to me, at least to my playstyle. I'll probably use two Landsknecht or add in a Dancer.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Ashton on March 05, 2013, 06:23:56 PM
I recently finished the game, so watch for my review in the coming week!

In the meantime, enjoy my Guild Card info:

(http://img16.imageshack.us/img16/737/eo4.png)

Also, anyone who wants QR scans for the treasure maps can do so here (https://www.dropbox.com/sh/rv8nlf4cld3sziz/jZ4nYJO4ao#/). Enjoy!
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Solstafir on March 05, 2013, 09:19:49 PM
Damn, I'm only in the second area with my infrequent playing. Looking forward to the review, though!

What's everyone's party composition? I'm current running with Land / Fort / Dancer in the front and Night / Medic in the back. The Nightblade is 10 levels behind everyone else, though, but once he's caught up he'll be switching with the Fortress. My plan is basically to take advantage of links and chasers and multiple hits/attacks to do ridiculous damage with the front line while the Fortress draws the ire of enemies and protects everyone as much as possible and the Medic heals. It's been working out fairly well already, even with my very unfinished party.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Cyril on March 05, 2013, 09:31:25 PM
For now I'm using Land/Rune, Fort/Dancer, Night/Bushi, Arcanist/Medic, Sniper/Arcanist

Later on I may turn my Sniper into more of a physical/link beast with Sniper/Dancer, but for now my Sniper is used primarily for Criticals, ignoring enemy defense, Binds, and Chase Binds while my Arcanist helps the Night land status effects and assists the Sniper with Chase Binds.

Unfortunately, I've noticed this game has the same issue as the other EOs.  That is - after the first stratum or two it becomes much easier.  The difficulty just doesn't remain consistent and you get stronger much more quickly than your enemies and the area "tricks" do.  I'm glad they did away with the Royal/Prince/Princess from EO3 though, it was just ridiculously unbalanced.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Fadedsun on March 06, 2013, 12:05:28 PM
People have been complaining that this game is far easier than the other games in the series. I don't really see it that way; I see it as the game being more balanced and fans being more experienced with the game itself. Does everyone remember how broken Immunize was in EO1? The game was near impossible without it.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Cyril on March 06, 2013, 01:02:24 PM
Eh, I find EO to be a pretty easy for a game/series in this genre in general and I'd consider it a nice entry point because of that.  I'm not sure if I agree with 4 being the easiest overall during the beginning, but later on it might well be simply because every class becomes powerful very quickly.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Fadedsun on March 07, 2013, 01:29:11 PM
QR codes thus far: http://suraph.hubpages.com/hub/Etrian-Odyssey-IV-Legends-of-the-Titans-QR-Codes-List

Japanese wiki: http://www32.atwiki.jp/sekaiju_mazeiv/

Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Starmongoose on March 07, 2013, 01:49:36 PM
Phew, took down the second Stratum boss today. I'm loving it so far, though the hardest part of these games for me ends up being unable to use all the classes at once. :P I want an Arcanist now that I've unlocked them but I've grown really fond of my

Landshneckt Dancer Nightseeker
Runemaster Medic

team.

EDIT: Also, am I close to getting subclasses yet? That might ease some of my woes. Though it brings up an all different set.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Fadedsun on March 07, 2013, 02:01:47 PM
Word on the street is that subclasses are unlocked in the
Code: [Select]
3rd stratum. Not sure if that's a spoiler or not. Just in case.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Cyril on March 07, 2013, 03:42:54 PM
That's right.  There's a boss about halfway through it that unlocks them, so you don't have to wait until you finish it.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Nel_Annette on March 08, 2013, 12:22:21 AM
I'm loving it more than the first three so far. Just beat the blood bear boss. I love the even that happens right after you beat it. It is a bit chilling.

Small question though: how do I drop stuff with the airship? I have that sidequest to drop off food for the soldiers in the Windy Plains, but I'm not sure how. The foodapult? What button do I press?

Also, how do I raise the altitude of the airship? Is that an ability for later?

EDIT: Nevermind, just found the drop option. Derp moment on my end.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Solstafir on March 08, 2013, 03:38:44 AM
Also, how do I raise the altitude of the airship? Is that an ability for later?
Spoilering it for safety:
Code: [Select]
You unlock it pretty shortly after entering the second area.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: John on March 08, 2013, 03:34:34 PM
OK, I knew this point was coming, but I've finally reached my "OK, I'm done grinding and there's not really a good story in this game" point.  Almost through the third maze, my party is level 42 and I unlocked subclassing.  The game was quite fun while I still had a stomach for it, though.  Definitely worth the money.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Cyril on March 08, 2013, 04:42:58 PM
Wow, you did grind.  I was 38 by the time I finished the 3rd Stratum.

It's funny because the 4th Stratum is when the story picks up, but, looking back, I liked the game's atmosphere overall best in the second area.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Fadedsun on March 08, 2013, 05:11:20 PM
I haven't had to grind at all yet. The game gives you so many options to get experience without having to grind(quests, missions, caves, rare breeds, etc.). The additional stat bonuses that food give you helps to alleviate some trouble against FOEs, too.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Embryon on March 08, 2013, 05:40:01 PM
I'm still in Labyrinth 2. Progress is a lot slower than I expected, but I refuse to switch to Casual. I refuse! I look forward to unlocking Arcanist. I'm probably going to replace my Medic because I find them overly specialized. A Dancer and an Arcanist should cover my bases, aside from revival. Guess I'll need to stock up on Nectar.

I also want to rest half of my party and re-allocate my skills, which I should've seen coming. I get so stressed out when it comes time to spend skill points!
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: John on March 08, 2013, 05:41:23 PM
I think I said "grinding" and meant a different context - I view most dungeon crawlers as a whole as "grinding" since they're almost entirely combat and exploration.  I didn't mean it in the "oh man I have to fight a bunch of enemies to get past the next thing".  In fact, EOIV has a pretty damn smooth difficulty curve, though things got really easy after I got subclassing - regen w/ active circle for an arcanist made it so I almost never died.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Eusis on March 09, 2013, 01:14:52 AM
I think I said "grinding" and meant a different context - I view most dungeon crawlers as a whole as "grinding" since they're almost entirely combat and exploration.  I didn't mean it in the "oh man I have to fight a bunch of enemies to get past the next thing".  In fact, EOIV has a pretty damn smooth difficulty curve, though things got really easy after I got subclassing - regen w/ active circle for an arcanist made it so I almost never died.

Yeah, at worst EO tends to only have masked grinding unless you're deliberately bringing extra characters up, and even then you can work around that with items (though maybe you only get two or three through the whole game?) or giving your new guys all the EXP from quests. Bailing out of dungeons because you got too much crap or drained of resources is SIMILAR to a grind, but at least I'm constantly pushing my envelope rather than just pacing back and forth for hours.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Ashton on March 09, 2013, 10:50:29 PM
My review is up[/URL}. I demand that you all be swayed by my opinion. I demand tribute! (http://www.rpgfan.com/reviews/Etrian_Odyssey_IV/index.html)
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Cyril on March 10, 2013, 06:01:44 AM
Good review and I agree.

I think one little small bonus I liked was that walls with shortcuts have "hints" that there's a shortcut there, so you don't need to turn sideways on every panel, since the wall panels have a new design or coloring variations.  This definitely saves time and I wish I had noticed it before the very obvious 4th Stratum. Next someone will tell me that it's been there in the earlier EOs and I never noticed.

Code: [Select]
The flowers on the walls of the first and second mazes, water down the walls in the third, so on, that mark the passage.
Once you recognize it, it's easy.

On a similar note, that cave where 80% of the secret passages damaged you was an absolute and utter nightmare.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Starmongoose on March 10, 2013, 06:49:57 AM
Sorry Cyril, they have been in every EO game. Though they were always flowers.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Cyril on March 10, 2013, 08:00:02 AM
Serves me right for never paying attention to the wall design closely, I suppose.   I think it's another of those small things that makes EO more accessible than older dungeon crawlers in that any visual clue is given at all.  I can see it being shocking when someone who starts the genre with EO plays something like Wizardry or even a newer title like The Dark Spire and you have to face everything in just the right way or you won't get any of the little "check" triggers where you can just stand on the block in this series.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Nel_Annette on March 10, 2013, 10:11:11 PM
Um... I killed all the Big Moths in Moth's Garden before taking on the RPGFan quest. Am I screwed? I mean, they aren't respawning. I think I ruined it for me. D:
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Ashton on March 10, 2013, 10:17:16 PM
They all respawn after a while, the respawn counter just resets at different points for different monsters. Even the bosses respawn.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: daschrier on March 11, 2013, 02:49:39 PM
Having trouble with the last boss in the lush woodlands. My whole party is level 18. L, N, M, S, and R.

Never had much luck with these games. I believe I just don't have my skills setup right. I wish the games had more stats in the descriptions, rather than just up and down arrows to indicate strength...
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Raze on March 11, 2013, 03:08:53 PM
Use http://crazyuncleivans.com/eo4skillsim/EO4Skillsim.html for character building. It doesn't have all the numbers, but it has most of them.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Starmongoose on March 11, 2013, 03:31:20 PM
Use http://crazyuncleivans.com/eo4skillsim/EO4Skillsim.html for character building. It doesn't have all the numbers, but it has most of them.

Why did I not know this existed earlier. Not knowing specific stats has been bugging me for a while.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Ashton on March 11, 2013, 05:30:55 PM
I can't believe how powerful Arcanists are late game. Early on they just kept dying and sucking and late game they're basically unstoppable when paired with Imperials. It's like they are Magikarp, but instead of Gyarados it evolves into Mewtwo.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Cyril on March 11, 2013, 08:18:49 PM
I had that same experience with Nightseekers.  My Nightseeker died over and over and over until 40ish or so, which is when Fortress gets its boost too, and then all of a sudden it starts pulling out 3k damage a turn with no effort at all.  Paired with an Arcanist who can reset status resistance, it's crazy.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Fadedsun on March 11, 2013, 11:10:59 PM
Before I even used them, I knew Arcanist was going to be my favorite class. So much fun to use. Basically, most classes don't show their worth until they hit 40 and up.

I was having a hard time deciding how to subclass my Medic, but I ultimately decided on Fortress and I think it was a really good choice. Now to figure out what to do with my Sniper...
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Cyril on March 11, 2013, 11:32:01 PM
Sniper/Dancer can pull out ridiculous damage at high (70+) levels, but to do so you effectively need to sacrifice its Bind utility outside of Leg Bind if you want to do the most possible damage with them.  You'll probably need to Rest it, then put all your points into the Critical bonuses and the offensive skills.  You keep Leg Bind because without support skills, the Squall attack has rather low accuracy.

You can also go pure Bind route with both your Arcanist and Sniper and focus on having your Sniper use its level 40 skill where it removes binds, but does a ton of damage (italicized for emphasis) and use Chase Bind/the Bind Crit skill.

Sniper and Arcanist are compliments to each other, what you do with your Sniper probably depends on how you built your Arcanist.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Nel_Annette on March 12, 2013, 02:04:19 AM
Any advice for getting to the back of the room in the third boss' room? You know, to ice stake his heat source or whatever. I have the little room to the left discovered already, if that helps. Also, is the special drop you get for killing it with fire attacks worth it?

Oh, and thanks for telling me about the respawns, Ashton. Coincidentally, right after you posted that was when FOEs started reappearing on my overworld map. nn;
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Fadedsun on March 12, 2013, 02:26:40 AM
Any advice for getting to the back of the room in the third boss' room? You know, to ice stake his heat source or whatever. I have the little room to the left discovered already, if that helps. Also, is the special drop you get for killing it with fire attacks worth it?

Oh, and thanks for telling me about the respawns, Ashton. Coincidentally, right after you posted that was when FOEs started reappearing on my overworld map. nn;

Not sure if it's a spoiler, but just in case.
Code: [Select]
Enter from the East door and bring about 5 ice spikes with you. If you walk towards the pool of water it will attract him, then walk counter-clockwise around the pool to knock out that first scale (the boss will always be two spaces behind you).From there you need to use a pole stone to return to the entrance. Rinse and repeat until the rest of the ice spikes are gone.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Nel_Annette on March 12, 2013, 03:25:40 AM
Thanks man. I'm way too impatient to have come up with that strategy. Boss is dead. And the first floor is back in "heat" mode so now it's a pain getting to where I need to go.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Farron on March 15, 2013, 10:01:24 AM
While I patiently wait for me copy to arrive I've been reading through some EOIV forums and noticed a lot of people are talking about links.
From the little I managed to gather and understand, you use a Landsknecth, a Dancer and maybe some other classes and when one of your characters attack other follow up without wasting a turn.

So, anyone here have been using this? If so, can someone explain to me as I've been playing a lot of the demo and I do have multiple characters in some classes and I was thinking of trying it out. Maybe I'll like it, maybe I won't but at least I'd like to know what to do.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Cyril on March 15, 2013, 04:04:01 PM
You don't really need a Dancer for links, they're just another link class.  Lands use Links in a specific, powerful build.

For a Land Link build, you use Land/Runemaster, and the skills Vanguard, Improved Link, and the level 40 one that increases damage.   Links are basically subsequent added elemental damage attacks added to the base attack.  You get your Land to attack first using the skill Vanguard, and every person who attacks after gets additional elemental damage.  When you're exploting a weakness, this elemental damage can be very impressive, but even when you're not it still adds quite a bit.  For example, it effectively doubles or triples the attack power of a dual-wielding Nightseeker.

You can also do Bind chain parties with Arcanists and Snipers, but it works a bit differently and focuses on the Sniper's Critical abilities and add/remove Binds.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Nel_Annette on March 15, 2013, 06:34:57 PM
These butterflies in the 5th area are dicks. That poison is brutal.

I like that they made a callback to that blond girl you could use in the first two games with the lookalike in the Imperial class.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Raze on March 15, 2013, 07:59:39 PM
I like that they made a callback to that blond girl you could use in the first two games with the lookalike in the Imperial class.

Code: [Select]
All four are callbacks. There's also a war magus, a medic, and a landshark. Or maybe more than just callbacks. I still need to go nab the game.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Nel_Annette on March 15, 2013, 08:08:07 PM
Shows how much I remember the player characters from the first games. XD

Almost done with the fifth area boss, but he keeps using this uber attack that one-shots my entire team. Time to grind everyone to level 70, I guess.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Cyril on March 15, 2013, 08:40:01 PM
These butterflies in the 5th area are dicks. That poison is brutal.

I like that they made a callback to that blond girl you could use in the first two games with the lookalike in the Imperial class.

Agreed.  They're horrible.  Until the Sixth Stratum, they were my least favorite enemy.

Code: [Select]
The petal mobs in the Sixth Stratum are officially the worst monsters in the game now, though.  I've Game Over'd
so many times because they just so happened to get lucky with an Ambush and mass petrification.   It seems to be level
based, fortunately, as my level has gone up its hit percentage has gone down and they don't hit 4/5 of my characters at
once as frequently.

You don't really need to grind to 70.  Which one are you having problems with?

Code: [Select]
If it's the Cursed Prince, you need to kill him fast or he'll start one-hitting you constantly. Otherwise,
he can't attack you constantly. The trick is to watch the color of his Drive Blade.  When it's orange, go all out.
When it's silver, try to Arm Bind/defend so he wastes his turn.  A Fortress really helps.

If you're having problems with the boss after that, I have to say at level 57 that was partially luck for me, but at 60 it
would have probably been safe.  Keep in mind there's an optional dungeon after the final boss that will pretty much
hand EXP out to you if you can survive said above petrification.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Nel_Annette on March 15, 2013, 09:15:40 PM
It would be the guy you mentioned. I guess I just need a better strategy to take him out faster. I still need to grind a bit though; I'm still trying to get my Imperial up to speed. I love getting new classes, but hand-holding them to catching up with the rest of my team is a bit of a hassle.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Ashton on March 15, 2013, 09:20:03 PM
You don't want him to use Ignition, that allows him the use of Overdrive which WILL kill a normal level team. Arm bind him as quickly as possible.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Nel_Annette on March 16, 2013, 12:29:51 AM
Finally managed to stop him with a well-timed Geo Impact. :)

This final battle is really making me wish I had chosen different subclasses for some of my guys though.

EDIT: Of course, as soon as I post that I realize that resting the characters clears the subclass too. Time to fix some things.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Draak on March 16, 2013, 07:21:55 PM
Despite my reservations about the 3DS, I ended up buying one for EO4. Game is gorgeous and I already prefer if over EO3. I'm going blind this time, hope I won't royally fuck up my party.

How I missed being wrecked by an FOE.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Nel_Annette on March 17, 2013, 10:58:26 PM
Man, I do not like the 6th Stratum. Not only is it genuinely creepy, but the second floor just made it worse.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Aurian on March 18, 2013, 12:58:45 AM
Just entered the Echoing Library. Where the f... is the stairs?
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Fadedsun on March 18, 2013, 01:38:11 AM
Just entered the Echoing Library. Where the f... is the stairs?

It's pretty straightforward through the Echoing Library. There's no secret entrance or anything to find the stairs.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Aurian on March 18, 2013, 08:40:35 PM
I don't see any.... I am in the building where the conference took place. Am I supposed to go to the other building?
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Fadedsun on March 18, 2013, 09:32:51 PM
I don't see any.... I am in the building where the conference took place. Am I supposed to go to the other building?

The Echoing Library is where you are supposed to be. I think you might be in the South Sanctuary.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Aurian on March 19, 2013, 12:39:23 AM
Oops thanks. I thought for some reason the flame was in the South Sanctuary. Now figured out I was supposed to move on. Thought those ships were still there. Derp.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Fadedsun on March 19, 2013, 02:53:35 AM
Just beat the main game. This has been one of my favorite games in recent memory and the final boss battle was fantastic. Definitely had me on the edge of my seat. Now for the post-game!
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Embryon on March 19, 2013, 01:09:10 PM
I'm still working on this too, but my progress was halted for a while by Atelier Ayesha. Now that I'm back on it, I made it to Labyrinth 3, and the enemies aren't giving me as much trouble as I expected them to. I replaced my Medic with an Arcanist, which still feels really weird, but I'm starting to get the hang of my new party dynamic. I miss Revive, but that's about it.

I'm excited to keep going! I have a feeling this game is going to be my standby for quite a while to come.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Nel_Annette on March 19, 2013, 08:44:01 PM
Just tried taking on the fire dragon... It effed me up. XD

But if I use the guest fighter's move's in an effective order, I think I can royally destroy that thing. I ended up doing over 4000 damage in one turn, which was awesome.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Fadedsun on March 25, 2013, 02:27:27 PM
News about Etrian Odyssey on Mar 28th? What?! http://www.nintendolife.com/news/2013/03/news_on_etrian_odyssey_devil_survivor_2_expected_in_next_famitsu
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Cyril on March 25, 2013, 02:45:51 PM
Wow, already?

I guess most of the development time for IV was working with the new engine.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Serene Prophet on March 26, 2013, 12:15:30 AM
So am I able to just build my characters without looking at a guide and do ok?  Im not much of a min/maxer or anything like that, so since I am about to finally crack my copy open, im worried ill be stuck in a perpetual trying to rebuild (via rest) to make it sort of thing.  Just curious.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Fadedsun on March 26, 2013, 12:31:26 AM
So am I able to just build my characters without looking at a guide and do ok?  Im not much of a min/maxer or anything like that, so since I am about to finally crack my copy open, im worried ill be stuck in a perpetual trying to rebuild (via rest) to make it sort of thing.  Just curious.

You should be fine. Only reason to look at a building guide is if you're really OCD about perfect builds. Looking at builds online ruins most of the fun for me, because then I feel like I didn't discover it on my own.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Farron on March 26, 2013, 08:06:50 AM
My EOIV should arrive today or at worse tomorrow (and I got it shipped before release) and where already anticipating news of the next one.

Funny thing about this series is when I played a little of EOIII I hated drawing my maps but surprisingly playing the demo of IV it wasn't that bad. I think this comes down to getting better at it and soon enough you won't spend too much time on it.

Since I'll start when most here are finishing, whatare the classes you find invaluable during the couse of the game? In the demo the ones I don't consider swtiching are Landsknecht, Medic and Dancer (which grew a lot on me lately).
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Fadedsun on March 26, 2013, 11:53:44 AM
New EO in June on 3DS. Wow, I can't believe it. http://www.siliconera.com/2013/03/26/new-etrian-odyssey-will-crawl-its-way-to-3ds-in-june/

It seems like it's a remake of the first game! http://tinycartridge.com/post/46335595551/another-etrian-odyssey-coming-to-3ds-though

@Farron, any class will be a good choice this time around. For me, I went with a party of Nightseeker, Medic, Arcanist, Sniper, Runemaster. The Nightseeker and Runemaster really shine late game with damage output.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: AuraChannelerChris on May 28, 2013, 02:55:02 PM
http://www.siliconera.com/2013/05/28/etrian-odyssey-iv-legends-of-the-titan-is-25-on-the-eshop/

This game here is 25% off at the eShop for $29.99 till June 10th.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Darilon on August 17, 2013, 03:20:13 PM
The demo for Etrian Odyssey IV has appeared on the European eShop. It was great fun and I will definitely be getting it, if not when it is released on the 5th then soon after. Really jealous of those in the US who have probably finished it at this stage. The battle theme was also awesome.

Now I only have to wait for Soul Hackers and SMT IV to be released on the European eShop :(
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Starmongoose on August 17, 2013, 03:45:48 PM
Have I mentioned how glad I am to have an American 3DS recently?
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Darilon on August 17, 2013, 04:13:28 PM
Have I mentioned how glad I am to have an American 3DS recently?

(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v239/takamizuna/comeuppance.jpg)

I was actually really happy with the 3D models used in the game. Thought they would lose some of their charm but the ones I encountered looked great. Tree rats actions in battle added a lot to it and I especially loved how it changes when its health depletes.

Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Raze on August 18, 2013, 12:40:08 PM
The battle theme was also awesome.

You'll be very disappointed when they change the main battle theme on you.

It won't last though, since it's just as good (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c1_7UQHIDcA)

Quote
Have I mentioned how glad I am to have an American 3DS recently?

If you're going to use our 3ds we must insist you put a eagle decal on it or something.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Starmongoose on August 18, 2013, 01:16:21 PM
I'm eating some Lucky Charms right now, can that be enough?
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Raze on August 18, 2013, 05:43:30 PM
Sounds Irish and pagan to me.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Darilon on August 18, 2013, 07:42:02 PM
I finished the demo. Great fun and a decent amount of content for just a demo. It did feel a bit easier than earlier entries but that may be just the beginning. Not saying it is an easy game, simply that I did not die in it. It may just be that the classes are more balanced in this one though.


The battle theme was also awesome.

You'll be very disappointed when they change the main battle theme on you.

It won't last though, since it's just as good (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c1_7UQHIDcA)

I wasn't sure of that song but it grew on me the more I heard it. I probably still prefer the first battle theme Storm but I think it is unfair for me to compare them as I have only heard one of them in actual battle. Storm really reminds me of some other game music. I think it is from Persona 4 but I can't remember for the life of me.

I'm eating some Lucky Charms right now, can that be enough?

Uh, well... Braveheart is a historically accurate movie? Curses! I have nothing on Scotland. Foiled once again by our countries cultural similarities.

Sounds Irish and pagan to me.

Lucky Charms are about as Irish as pinching someone not wearing green on Saint Patrick's day.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Raze on August 19, 2013, 02:08:25 AM
 Oh yeah, on the subject of the music, set your 3ds(not the game) to stereo instead of surround and it'll sound better.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Starmongoose on August 19, 2013, 01:24:35 PM
Braveheart is a historically accurate movie?

Shut yo mouth.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: AuraChannelerChris on August 19, 2013, 03:37:15 PM
Game is $10 cheaper in the NA eShop till August 31st.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: AuraChannelerChris on September 24, 2013, 01:32:16 PM
http://www.siliconera.com/2013/09/24/soul-hackers-etrian-odyssey-iv-and-hakuoki-get-price-drops-on-nintendo-eshop/

And now this game's price has permanently been dropped to $30, along with Soul Hackers, in the eShop.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Artimicia on August 28, 2016, 11:28:07 AM
Sorry to be resurrecting 2 random threads at once... but yeah basically I was looking at 3DS games I missed, and this and Legacy came out (well and Langrisser).

I'm not sure about Langrisser, but like with Legacy, did anyone play this (non Demo) how was it, if so?
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Starmongoose on August 28, 2016, 02:11:39 PM
It's good, but I thought 3 was better.

It's not exactly like the games change much between iterations.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Mickeymac92 on August 28, 2016, 04:07:44 PM
It's good, but I thought 3 was better.

It's not exactly like the games entire First-person Dungeon-crawling genre changes much between iterations.

Fixed that for ya. There are ones that stumble, and the occasional odd branch that looks kinda like a new concept, but otherwise if you liked the demo, and have even a little experience with the genre...well, what you saw is what you get, so there's not really much left to ask about.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Hathen on August 28, 2016, 08:56:41 PM
IV was a bit easy for series veterans, but that means it might be better for newcomers, not to mention it has a lot of great interface changes which makes things a lot less annoying. If you're stuck between this and that piece of crap 3DS Langrisser, I think it's a no-brainer which to get.

V's already out in Japan though, so dunno if we'll be seeing that stateside anytime soon.
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Artimicia on August 29, 2016, 12:13:14 AM
Well I'd already heard Etrian Odyssey was better, heard about it a few times from other places...
Title: Re: Etrian Odyssey IV announced for 3DS
Post by: Towns Car Marty on August 29, 2016, 03:12:07 AM
The EO games are pretty iterative, as Star said, but they're all pretty great. 4 is worth playing, and also a good place for newcomers to start. 3 will always be my favorite, though.