RPGFan Message Boards

Media => Single-Player RPGs => Topic started by: Yggdrasil on May 02, 2013, 07:50:07 PM

Title: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: Yggdrasil on May 02, 2013, 07:50:07 PM
(http://i.imgur.com/PkLgpDJ.jpg)

"The "lost art" referenced in the thread title isn't meant to describe this content as having been lost and found – it refers to the art details that were lost when the graphics were downconverted to a limited 32-bit console." -- NeoGAF (http://www.neogaf.com/forum/showpost.php?p=56379000&postcount=1)

Credits to Mama Robotnik.
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: Starmongoose on May 02, 2013, 08:07:09 PM
This feels relevant due to all our gushing about this game today.

FFIX was always a beautiful game but I would love to have been able to play this one.

Also, It's only just struck me as bizzare as hell that Blank wears a belt across his face.
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: Sagacious-T on May 02, 2013, 08:51:28 PM
I still haven't played it.

8)
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: DPB on May 02, 2013, 09:00:14 PM
There's a lot of fantastic art there, it really makes me wish they'd make another Final Fantasy without Nomura's grubby hands all over it.

The only thing I don't like about FFIX is that ATB doesn't quite work as it should - with the some of the animations taking so long you end up with lots of commands stacking.
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: MeshGearFox on May 02, 2013, 09:02:55 PM
I'm not sure if the commands actually /stacked/. I think the game accounted for animation time.

The bigger issue was that the framerate was low and everything took a lot longer than it should've.

(Still my favorite FF game 5ever).

An HD remake of FFIX would actually make sense and be pretty simple to do. I mean... literally, just package all the non-downscaled assets in it and pick a reasonable framerate. I don't think the models would even need to be altered much, if at all.
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: Klutz64 on May 02, 2013, 09:05:20 PM
I still have "The Art of Final Fantasy IX" and I still look through it every now and then. It's a constant reminder of how much I miss Amano doing the in-game art instead of just concepts and title images.
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: Yggdrasil on May 02, 2013, 09:21:27 PM
I still haven't played it.

8)

You should be ashamed of yourself.

There's a lot of fantastic art there, it really makes me wish they'd make another Final Fantasy without Nomura's grubby hands all over it.

You mean for the characters? Because as far as I know Nomura has never done environmental art.
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: Raze on May 02, 2013, 09:23:28 PM
Oh for fucks sake...

(http://i.imgur.com/Du48mZR.jpg)
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: DPB on May 02, 2013, 09:40:03 PM
You mean for the characters? Because as far as I know Nomura has never done environmental art.

Yes, but he's also been Director or Producer for many of their recent games, so he's still going to have a big influence on the overall art style. He wasn't involved in FFIX at all, and it looks completely different to the stuff they've put out recently.

And yes, I realise the irony of posting this when there's a picture of a guy with a belt strapped to his head.
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: Kevadu on May 02, 2013, 10:10:45 PM
Oh for fucks sake...

(http://i.imgur.com/Du48mZR.jpg)

The man likes belts, OK.
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: Dice on May 02, 2013, 10:13:55 PM
I'm surprised that if a remake wasn't in the cards they wouldn't do the HD editions.  Makes me kinda blue we've seen (I'm speaking for myself) the better FF's get the same treatment as I-IV and X-X2
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: Yggdrasil on May 02, 2013, 10:52:07 PM
Yes, but he's also been Director or Producer for many of their recent games, so he's still going to have a big influence on the overall art style. He wasn't involved in FFIX at all, and it looks completely different to the stuff they've put out recently.

Aside from fulfilling the usual role of character designer recently he has being a creative producer for Crisis Core, both Dissidia titles and Type-0.

The only game everyone will have every right to bitch about for the art direction is Versus XIII because he is the director there. Oh and Kingdom Hearts... he takes charge of that franchise too.
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: Zik on May 03, 2013, 02:49:50 AM
This looks really good, nice find! Oh now I wish they release a remake.
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: Lard on May 03, 2013, 09:22:10 AM
I still haven't played it.

Why not?
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: Taelus on May 03, 2013, 04:59:38 PM
I still haven't played it.

Why not?

He's got a point.
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: Zik on May 03, 2013, 07:11:02 PM
I still haven't played it.

Why not?

He's got a point.

A strong point indeed. In fact, I don't see any good reason to not play this.
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: Dice on May 03, 2013, 07:14:23 PM
I still haven't played it.

Why not?

He's got a point.

A strong point indeed. In fact, I don't see any good reason to not play this.

indubitably
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: Taelus on May 04, 2013, 02:45:32 AM
I still haven't played it.

Why not?

He's got a point.

A strong point indeed. In fact, I don't see any good reason to not play this.

indubitably

You guys have given me the greatest gift of all.
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: Dice on May 04, 2013, 03:05:21 AM
I still haven't played it.

Why not?

He's got a point.

A strong point indeed. In fact, I don't see any good reason to not play this.

indubitably

You guys have given me the greatest gift of all.

Life.
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: Alisha on May 04, 2013, 03:37:03 AM
while i like FF9 i think its highly over rated
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: Yggdrasil on May 04, 2013, 03:52:00 AM
while i like FF9 i think its highly over rated

Nah.
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: Lard on May 04, 2013, 02:07:18 PM
while i like FF9 i think its highly over rated

Nah.

He's got a point.
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: PotRoast on May 04, 2013, 04:49:37 PM
I've said this before that if you look at all the parts of FFIX, it seems great, but put it together and it bores me so much. I've given this a lot more thought recently, and I think I know the two parts that really bother me: The battles are atrociously slow (even if otherwise sound) and the battle music is awful. The remake would have to be more than just cosmetic to make me happy.
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: Yggdrasil on May 04, 2013, 05:24:20 PM
The battles are atrociously slow (even if otherwise sound) and the battle music is awful.

...I don't know man.

Chrono Cross - Gale (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sJeHtVIGsWY)
Final Fantasy X - Normal Battle (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tmoQIqvtrZQ)
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: Klutz64 on May 04, 2013, 05:30:52 PM
Are you implying that the normal battle theme in FFX isn't fantastic? Shame on you.
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: Yggdrasil on May 04, 2013, 06:01:58 PM
Are you implying that the normal battle theme in FFX isn't fantastic? Shame on you.

Is good enough for the role that track has to fulfill, but as a stand-alone piece of music it has never done anything for me (I rather hear 'Birth of a God' (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FpOHHicI-vY) from FFVII instead).
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: Lard on May 04, 2013, 10:47:03 PM
I know the two parts that really bother me: The battles are atrociously slow (even if otherwise sound) and the battle music is awful.

All FF battle music is kind of meh. It's just that they all get repetitive because of the grinding.

As for the slow part, FF8 has slower battles.
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: pseudonym on May 04, 2013, 10:54:20 PM
while i like FF9 i think its highly over rated

Agreement granted.

I liked it, but it is over rated.

Quote
As for the slow part, FF8 has slower battles.

They are both too slow. FF8, while having some interesting things to it, was a bad game.
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: PotRoast on May 05, 2013, 09:32:43 AM
The battles are atrociously slow (even if otherwise sound) and the battle music is awful.

...I don't know man.

Chrono Cross - Gale (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sJeHtVIGsWY)
Final Fantasy X - Normal Battle (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tmoQIqvtrZQ)

Neither of those games are ATB system. They are straight turn-based, no waiting for actions (except cast animation could be pretty long at times). I am fine with their speed.

All FF battle music is kind of meh. It's just that they all get repetitive because of the grinding.

As for the slow part, FF8 has slower battles.

I disagree on all three points.
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: Dincrest on May 05, 2013, 11:33:46 AM
FF9 is like mom's cooking.  You don't appreciate it at all when you're growing up but when you're older, go off on your own (like to college or something) then you realize how "together" mom's cooking is. 

I see that with FF9.  When it first came out, it wasn't as fresh, sexy, or exciting as the McDonald's we wanted as kids (esp. those with the play areas) but as we've grown and matured, we lately seem to appreciate FF9 more because it was cohesive (it did not have screwy plot holes, straight-up plot cop-outs, or brooding self-hating characters like FF7 and 8 did).  And, hey, even when stuff's spiraling out of control, somehow mom pulls it all together come dinner time. 
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: Starmongoose on May 05, 2013, 04:38:55 PM
Phoar, you milked that simile for all it was worth. I think you are right though, but just like my mum's cooking I preferred it as a kid and just grew to like it more as I got older :P
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: pseudonym on May 05, 2013, 11:39:14 PM
FF9 is like mom's cooking.  You don't appreciate it at all when you're growing up but when you're older, go off on your own (like to college or something) then you realize how "together" mom's cooking is. 

I see that with FF9.  When it first came out, it wasn't as fresh, sexy, or exciting as the McDonald's we wanted as kids (esp. those with the play areas) but as we've grown and matured, we lately seem to appreciate FF9 more because it was cohesive (it did not have screwy plot holes, straight-up plot cop-outs, or brooding self-hating characters like FF7 and 8 did).  And, hey, even when stuff's spiraling out of control, somehow mom pulls it all together come dinner time. 

Some moms can't or won't cook. When I think of good eating (southern guy), I think of Grandma's cooking. Her cooking is like crack for fat kids.

I probably need to replay FF9 again. I wish there was some way to speed up the battle time.
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: MeshGearFox on May 06, 2013, 02:25:30 AM
My grandma's food was largely inedible to the extant that if you did eat it you'd probably need a hospital visit.

I'm not even being sarcastic. The amount of non-food items that wound up in her food (plastic, glass, clumps of hair) was astonishing, and she refrigerated all of NOTHING. I am vomiting internally just thinking about it.

The video game equivalent of my grandmother's cooking would be one of those interactive flash ads that pretends to be a game. Only you find it on some questionable Russian bittorrent website. And it gives you a virus and spews porn ads at you when you accidentally click it.
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: pseudonym on May 06, 2013, 02:48:52 AM
My grandma's food was largely inedible to the extant that if you did eat it you'd probably need a hospital visit.

I'm not even being sarcastic. The amount of non-food items that wound up in her food (plastic, glass, clumps of hair) was astonishing, and she refrigerated all of NOTHING. I am vomiting internally just thinking about it.

The video game equivalent of my grandmother's cooking would be one of those interactive flash ads that pretends to be a game. Only you find it on some questionable Russian bittorrent website. And it gives you a virus and spews porn ads at you when you accidentally click it.

I'm pretty sure your grandma didn't like you.

Seriously, how in the crud do you manage to get glass in your food? Was she bringing broken bottles home from her bar fights? Good grief. I'll eat another helping of my grandma's non-glass casserole in honor for you.
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: Dincrest on May 06, 2013, 05:37:43 PM
You get the idea in my analogy, though. 

But, yeah, grandma's cooking is great too.  I very much enjoyed my grandma's cooking my last couple of trips to India. 

And this is probably the 371,292,854,089th time I've used the comfort food analogy when discussing FF9. 
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: MeshGearFox on May 06, 2013, 10:14:50 PM
My grandma's food was largely inedible to the extant that if you did eat it you'd probably need a hospital visit.

I'm not even being sarcastic. The amount of non-food items that wound up in her food (plastic, glass, clumps of hair) was astonishing, and she refrigerated all of NOTHING. I am vomiting internally just thinking about it.

The video game equivalent of my grandmother's cooking would be one of those interactive flash ads that pretends to be a game. Only you find it on some questionable Russian bittorrent website. And it gives you a virus and spews porn ads at you when you accidentally click it.

I'm pretty sure your grandma didn't like you.

Seriously, how in the crud do you manage to get glass in your food? Was she bringing broken bottles home from her bar fights? Good grief. I'll eat another helping of my grandma's non-glass casserole in honor for you.

She was making tacos and the eggbeater she was using to stir the meat started chipping off pieces of the glass bowl she was using it on or something.
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: Yggdrasil on May 07, 2013, 11:08:27 PM
Neither of those games are ATB system. They are straight turn-based, no waiting for actions (except cast animation could be pretty long at times). I am fine with their speed.

I was pointing out more the music than the battle systems themselves.
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: Lard on May 08, 2013, 12:00:57 AM
You get the idea in my analogy, though. 

But, yeah, grandma's cooking is great too.  I very much enjoyed my grandma's cooking my last couple of trips to India. 

And this is probably the 371,292,854,089th time I've used the comfort food analogy when discussing FF9. 

It's a good analogy actually.

So good that I've started a replay.
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: pseudonym on May 08, 2013, 09:56:19 AM
You get the idea in my analogy, though.   

It was a good analogy. Just stay away from Mesh's grandma.
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: PotRoast on May 08, 2013, 12:09:31 PM
I love the Final Fantasy series, but improving with age is not something I really associate with any of them. My opinion of most of them has stayed the same. That said, IX is definitely among those I think less of now (including VIII and X). Games that I appreciate more with age tend to be the ones that do something weird or strange that I might not have understood well in my younger years but impresses me as I get older. FFIX is by design a throw-back. It does almost nothing in terms of innovation, though it does what it does reasonable well. I do appreciate its craftsmanship, but feels very bland in comparison to other games of its era.


Neither of those games are ATB system. They are straight turn-based, no waiting for actions (except cast animation could be pretty long at times). I am fine with their speed.

I was pointing out more the music than the battle systems themselves.
That's what I get for not clicking on the links because I've played the games too much :P And yeah, you're right. Those battle themes are obnoxious now.
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: MeshGearFox on May 08, 2013, 07:29:12 PM
You get the idea in my analogy, though.    

It was a good analogy. Just stay away from Mesh's grandma.


She's dead, bro.

Surprisingly enough, not for the reasons you might be expecting, either!
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: pseudonym on May 11, 2013, 10:59:28 PM
Quote from: MeshGearFox

She's dead, bro.

Surprisingly enough, not for the reasons you might be expecting, either!

I guess she pulled herself out of the ditch and edited your post for you. lol

 
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: insertnamehere on May 12, 2013, 08:24:46 PM
FF9 on GBC (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3zDuP7LNf28)
It does look pretty impressive.
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: Dice on May 12, 2013, 08:26:45 PM
I must suck, but I hate the whole de-make idea.
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: MeshGearFox on May 12, 2013, 11:46:25 PM
Demakes can lead to really cool mechanics if the person behind them is genuinely interested in what they're doing and not just being HRR DRR THIS LOOKS 8-BIT.

Ideally when doing a demake, you're adopting a constrained format, and constraints can breed creativity.

Most people behind those things aren't being that creative though.
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: Dice on May 13, 2013, 04:43:00 PM
^ Kudos to the FF9 demake for changing the gamestyle; but generally yeah...since GBC games can't handle much, their games are best left to simple designs.  A GBA or DS sort of demake would be a bit more interesting and certainly let them be more flexible.
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: Yggdrasil on May 14, 2013, 02:55:23 AM
Modern Games get Demakes (http://pxlbyte.com/art/modern-games-de-made-by-junkboy/) -- Source: Pxlbyte
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: MeshGearFox on May 20, 2013, 08:20:49 PM
Man though wrt the soul food comment, I think that makes sense for a lot of people, but for me, when I was actually into the OLD FF games, I didn't like FFIX, and by the time I LIKED FFIX, I'd really lost interest in older, traditional fantasy jarpegs.

---edit---

So maybe another way of looking at it is this: Stylistically, for me, it's not so much a return to a cherished style from a bygone era, but rather RPG classicism informed by modern sensibilities. Actively working within a set style while moving away from some of the execution-related problems that hampered the full exploitation of that style's potential.

Actually maybe that kid of mindset is what's driving demakes, too. If you think of them less as minimalist re-interpretations and more as remakes of games that never existed...
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: Taelus on May 21, 2013, 12:36:59 AM
jarpegs.

Thread, you had one job. You have performed it admirably.
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: Yggdrasil on May 27, 2013, 01:52:31 PM
New Final Fantasy IX side quest discovered (http://gematsu.com/2013/05/new-final-fantasy-ix-side-quest-discovered) -- Source: Gematsu

"A new Final Fantasy IX side quest has been discovered, thirteen years after the game's release."
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: Dice on May 27, 2013, 02:06:22 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9vYMDCuS_lA

Yup. And here's the video.


EDIT: SEE YGGS POST

Man, can't blame anyone for missing this -- it's really, really damn obscure.  Even if you DID catch the first sequence, you have to keep coming back (if I read it right) after EACH major boss/event the game throws at you (and really no real understandable task to do, and it just kinda ...ends).  I call this bragging rights for sure, but hot damn... what a cool find.  I'm kinda surprised no one saw the game's code for this either (apparently treasure FAQs don't have it listed either).
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: Yggdrasil on May 27, 2013, 02:20:43 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9vYMDCuS_lA

Yup. And here's the video.

...the video is also in the link I put. ~_~

Anyway, I seem to remember seeing a similar scene when I was playing the game years ago but I'm not sure.
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: Dice on May 27, 2013, 02:37:33 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9vYMDCuS_lA

Yup. And here's the video.

...the video is also in the link I put. ~_~

Anyway, I seem to remember seeing a similar scene when I was playing the game years ago but I'm not sure.

D'oh!  Sorry I hit the Gamefaqs link, read all ten pages and forgot about the video already in the link. D:
Really sorry Yggy; I hate stepping over like that.

But yeah, even if someone SAW the first scene, it can *hardly* expected to make something like 8 return trips at strange intervals.
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: Yggdrasil on May 27, 2013, 02:53:06 PM
So I went to the FF wiki to see if the Protect Ring was any good and this is what you can find there (link (http://finalfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/Protect_Ring#Final_Fantasy_IX)):

"The Protect Ring is an add-on that halves the damage from all elements, as well as providing +1 Spirit, +2 Defense, +4 Evasion, +3 Magic Defense, and +6 Magic Evasion. It teaches the abilities Half MP, Long Reach, and Mag Elm Null, and can either be bought from Mene for 8,500 points, or synthesized for 40,000 gil, Rebirth Ring, and Dark Matter at Hades's Synthesis shop. Others can be acquired by completing the Mognet sidequest, using a Dead Pepper at a mountain crack on the eastern part of the Lost Continent, and by answering all of the Ragtime Mouse's questions correctly."
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: Aeolus on May 27, 2013, 07:01:09 PM
So I went to the FF wiki to see if the Protect Ring was any good and this is what you can find there (link (http://finalfantasy.wikia.com/wiki/Protect_Ring#Final_Fantasy_IX)):

"The Protect Ring is an add-on that halves the damage from all elements, as well as providing +1 Spirit, +2 Defense, +4 Evasion, +3 Magic Defense, and +6 Magic Evasion. It teaches the abilities Half MP, Long Reach, and Mag Elm Null, and can either be bought from Mene for 8,500 points, or synthesized for 40,000 gil, Rebirth Ring, and Dark Matter at Hades's Synthesis shop. Others can be acquired by completing the Mognet sidequest, using a Dead Pepper at a mountain crack on the eastern part of the Lost Continent, and by answering all of the Ragtime Mouse's questions correctly."

To be fair, I only played through the game once back when it first came out and then had my memory card reformatted to make room for a stupid anime fighting game. Despite the occasional attempt, I never actually made it back to disk 4 again due to the game being a boring slog and both of my PSXes being PoSes.

Also I didn't even know that the hideout was accessible given that almost everywhere that isn't the final dungeon, the chocobo sidequest spots, Treno, the Qu marshes, Quina's mentor's place, or the BMV had a severe overgrowth problem.
Title: Re: The lost art of Final Fantasy IX
Post by: Lard on May 27, 2013, 08:16:08 PM
Sweet. On disc 2 now. Have to try it out.