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Next Quiz Date: January 11, 2014
Subject: 999 (Nintendo DS)
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6691  Media / Single-Player RPGs / Re: Best RPG of Last Generation? on: March 09, 2009, 12:11:37 PM
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FF12 was an abomination (it perfectly captures the feel of a standard MMORPG but in 1P mode...great!),

Wait, wait. I have to object to this. Diablo 2 and PSO are both fairly similar games that are... MMO-ish, event hough they're not MASSIVELY multiplayer but more like small-team multiplayer but you get the drift. I liked D2 more because I thought PSO's random dungeon generator was hella off, and I DO NOT AGREE WITH HAVING TO KILL EVERYTHING IN A ROOM TO CONTINUE THIS IS TEDIOUS AND BAD GRR. But I liked them both pretty well. I also think I'd really like an offline, single player Ultima Online type game, although, I admit, that'd just be Ultima 7 with a skill system, but uh... nothing wrong with that.

So FFXII CLEARLY can't have the feeling of a standard MMORPG in 1P mode or otherwise I might've liked it more. So, why isn't it?

* Well, maybe I'm wrong about this, but did the game have any interesting treasures, rare drops, or just cool stuff to find lying about? Did it have collectible sets of armor or unique weapons that got dropped by enemies? To the best of my knowledge, it didn't. The loot kind of sucked. Did you even find weapons, in general, in chests?

* UO was pretty interactive and all of it's skills were linked to stuff you could do. Was FFXII all that interactive? Well, again, not really. And was there a lot of stuff you could do? Again, not really. You could kill things, I guess, but even then -- even just looking at the combat only skills -- the things you had were pretty limitted compared to most other FF games. D2, for that matter, had some nice skill trees.

* PSO and D2 both had really unique character classes with very different abilities, leading to replay value and group dynamics.

* Finally, there's no crafting, fishing, or mining. All of which are pretty standard now in MMOs, all of which are pretty cool to have, and all of which should really be present in more 1P games.

So, I guess FFXII is like a single player clone of an MMO, only without all the features that in theory make MMOs fun.

(Not trying to be combative with the person I'm quoting, by the way. My point is that I agree with them, honestly, it's just that FFXII is a rather feature-poor game. I don't hate it or anything [although I'd argue that the writing was damned odd] but I got bored with it because of the lack of features. Maybe features isn't the best word to use. What I mean is there wasn't a lot to do, I found).
6692  Media / Single-Player RPGs / Re: Dragon Quest V on: March 09, 2009, 04:09:09 AM
As a port job, in general, this feels better than DQIV did so far. I mean, yes, the translation IS better, but DQIV felt a bit half-assed at times, and they made the pilgrim town *really* stupid. I don't really know why (although the enemy animation got a huge boost over DQ4). This remake just feels a lot more... together.
6693  Media / Single-Player RPGs / Re: Ys 7 and another Ys I & II remake announced... for consoles? on: March 09, 2009, 02:19:49 AM
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I wonder if Atlus might pick those up actually, assuming Falcom published themselves. It'd be nice to get them if they're notably better than the three LoH games we already go.

It sounds like the three LoH games that got localized were the worst and the series and some of the other ones are considered classics or something.
6694  The Rest / General Discussions / Re: RPGFan Super Game Journal Turbo II - The New Challengers on: March 09, 2009, 02:09:58 AM
Did the first two missions in the Kohan campaign. This is... kind of what I wish Age of Empires would've been like, I mean, if I wasn't viewing AoE through the lens of nostalgia. Also I'm kind of digging the storyline as it's really reminding me of Fist of the North star. Like, the Kohan are kind of like the nanto seiken guys, and Darius is sort of like Kenshiro.

And for the hell of it let's say the Custodian is Toki.

I have no life :(

Zone of supply thing is probably the best innovation though, still. If only because you have something like: R - Resource. O - Outpost. T - Town.

R
|
O--T
|
R

Where you have an outpost built to connect the resources to the town, you could potentially go in, take out the fairly harmless outpost, and sort of fubar the entire enemy wingdong. Sort of like in MAX with blowing out supply pipes. I'd really like a dedicated strategy RPG with something like that (and, as I've said, incorporate the whole concept of capturing towns for resources. Jagged Alliance 2 was the closest, since you need to capture uh... mines and towns for money, but IIRC no real supply chains involved).

Oh, the other interesting thing that feeds into this is that towns also produce resources, depending on what you build in them. Or, they SELL resources if you build the related structures and you have surplus. You can expand towns to build more slots, although because of the way upgraded buildings work (You build a quarry. Quarries produce stone. On upgrade you can either have it produce more stone, sell stone, or reduce unit costs) it's impossible to make every town exactly identical and still have a functioning resource chain. I really, really, really damn like this for city management, and I don't know how well it'd work in something like Civ 4 or Galciv, but it'd be interesting to see.

Anyway, I'd like to play some various other PC RPGs right now -- namely finish Quest for glory 2 and start 4. And Entomorph, for that matter. I already mentioned that -- but those are on my laptop. And uh, being home for spring break, my laptop desk is more or less inaccessible because of this thing: http://img16.imageshack.us/img16/8360/pineaplevlaptop.jpg . I don't like moving it around constantly because that seems like a good way to puncture my face.
6695  Media / Single-Player RPGs / Re: Best RPG of Last Generation? on: March 09, 2009, 02:00:31 AM
Just 'cause the staff liked SO3 didn't mean anyone ELSE did :(

Although I have to say FFX confuses me more. Not so much it being on there. Just... #2? Can I toss that up to primacy?

Anyway P3 isn't my personal favorite game of the last gen but from an objective standpoint it's probably the best put-together in a lot of ways.
6696  Media / Single-Player RPGs / Re: Will we ever see a new Seiken Densetsu game? on: March 08, 2009, 11:21:22 PM
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I'd say that Seiken Densetsu is right up there with the SaGa series as one of Square's most versatile franchisees

Okay there are parts of this I kind of disagree with. Every Saga game's mostly adhered to fairly similar underlying principles, if not exactly the same gameplay mechanics. In other words, I guess since the second game, if you take any two games in the series and look at any particular gameplay mechanic, it'll probably have an analogue in another game in the series. None of the Saga games have completely changed genres, though, in the same way the seiken densetsu series did.

Also, I'm not sure I'd really call the new SD games innovative, from what I've read about them. Mind, I only played Sword of Mana. Anyway, you said you're all for innovation, but the thing is, how is taking a generic dungeon crawl and slapping SD flavor text on it innovative? Or a generic RTS? Or a generic 3D platformer? I'm all for a series branching out into other genres, I guess,

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but I will still argue to this day that the game was ahead of its time and a wonder that essentially followed a single-player MMORPG format before there were even such things as console MMORPGs.

LoM actually followed the semi-non-linear*, quest-based RPG format, which has been around since like, the eighties. The main thing LoM did was group a lot of the quests into consistent storylines, whereas something like Might and Magic just had a lot of one off events. Morrowind's quest structures, in relation to the guilds, actually, might be a bit similar, but then Oblivion sort of returned to more one-off events for everything except the assassins guild so ochen goddamnz.

Anyway all things considered I tend to think that from an action standpoint Terranigma is probably my favorite action RPG. All of the first four SD games had weird gameplay issues. SD3 was the only one with really decent AI, none of the stats in SD2 actually DID anything (thought that didn't seem to matter), SD2 was sort of glitchy, all of the games have a lot of non-useful spells, SD3 was slow and took out the free weapon selection thing that the other three had, legend of mana was not difficult, SD2 was the only one that actually had solid dungeon designs (LoM and 3 were kind of bland, SD1 had issues with keys and mattocks and getting stuck and also kind of bland), and you could probably argue that none of them ever really got the level of polish they needed.

They're all old as hell though so it's not like if-onlies really matter, though.

* Weird point I feel like mentioning is that the way the quest lines were structured, LoM wasn't really all that non-linear. You did have one-off events, and you could hop around between the three main and three minor arcs however much you felt like, but each of the arcs tended to be really linear, with the exception of some missable quests or decisions you could make (Like uh not making Daena get dead or whever). Similarly, a lot of the Saga games are pretty linear, with the two huge exceptions being RS1 and 3 which are veering more towards the Bethesda & Might and Magic flavor of nonlinearity, which is generally pretty much restricted to either the Might and Magic games or games made by Bethesda. And even at that Bethesda's kind of nonlinearity is different and I can't explain how at all (other than, I mean, DAggerfall being entirely randomly generated and I'd argue that this was a goddamn stupid decision and that the hardcore fans of that game are I don't know SOMETHING).
6697  Media / Single-Player RPGs / Re: Best RPG of Last Generation? on: March 08, 2009, 11:11:08 PM
I wonder if I should toss Tales of Symphonia into the ring, here, since, other than Nocturne, it's the game from last generation I played the most. I have a hard time explaining WHY I liked it so much, though. Not having Abyss' endless loadtime hell certainly *helped* I guess. Some of the things I liked were that, while it was linear for a lot of it, it didn't really feel stuck on rails. There were nice little side things you could do. The story wasn't great and it's not like it was all that well written or anything, but it didn't get all that wanky or fauxlosophical (Abyss kind of looked like it was heading that direction before I got sick of the load times) and when it did it was still cute enough to counterbalance it. Also, the dungeons had a nice degree of interactivity thanks to the Ring Thing, and it was pretty and atmospheric.

Or, that was just a really dreadful summer for me when it came out and it was the only emotional crutch I had. Whatevs, dawgs and dawgettes.
6698  Media / Single-Player RPGs / Re: Will we ever see a new Seiken Densetsu game? on: March 08, 2009, 12:21:59 AM
Like a lot of games, various SD games were my favorite games till I played better games.
6699  The Rest / General Discussions / Re: RPGFan Super Game Journal Turbo II - The New Challengers on: March 07, 2009, 08:40:20 PM
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Well, Best Buy screwed up

Yep.

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I started a game of FFVII for some reason and i'm just about to leave Midgar.

How many hours does it take you to get up to this point?

Anyway, after like, five years, finally getting around to playing that copy of Kohan I got for free when I bought Riven and Exile a few years ago (and by a few I mean five years ago). (at a store). I was assuming it was a heavily RPGish strategy game like HoMM3 or Disciples 2, but it's actually not. You have hero units, but they're not the same. The way the resources is handled is pretty neat, though. You find resource locations (gold, wood, stones, or irons) and build mines on them like in most RTSes. This is different, though, because the mines have to be within a city's "zone of supply" to do any good. So you either need to grow the city, or plant outposts so you can form a contiguous supply chain. Then, after you have these resources linked up to your city, they don't get stockpiled. RAther, you have to build buildings that sell them for gold or mana. It's actually kind of like Seven Kingdoms 2 except you don't have situations where you provide jobs to an enemy town and they defect because their original country's job market sucked.
6700  Media / Single-Player RPGs / Re: Persona port for PSP? on: March 07, 2009, 01:20:21 PM
Whatever Black Mark is still the only Mark for me.
6701  Media / Single-Player RPGs / Re: Best RPG of Last Generation? on: March 06, 2009, 10:21:08 PM
My favorite anime is Fist of the North Star, and the fact that there aren't any comparable videogames saddens me.
6702  Media / Single-Player RPGs / Re: Fantasy RPGs? on: March 06, 2009, 10:12:10 AM
SMT:N was actually pretty good about that, in regards to cost v. effectiveness. I mean, in regards to your main dude, switching from agi to like, agilao eventually is probably a good idea just because of limited spell slots, but you'll usually want to keep both the single and multiple hit form of a spell around at the same time for MP management.

Although that game was built entirely around elemental weaknesses really.
6703  Media / Single-Player RPGs / Re: Best RPG of Last Generation? on: March 05, 2009, 07:52:17 PM
The first few hours of Skies of Arcadia kind of don't go anywhere yeah.

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The list didn't include PC games, and many if not most WRPG's debut on PC.  I thought that was intentional (PC games are difficult to categorize by generation).

You can kind of do it based around system requirements and game-style trends, but yeah. It's easiest just to arbitrarily define a new generation of PC games as starting every five years. So like, 1980-1985-1990-1995-2000-2005-2010. Etc.
6704  Media / Single-Player RPGs / Re: Best RPG of Last Generation? on: March 05, 2009, 03:35:40 AM
In regards to DDS, the monster eating thing never jives with me. As I've said before, it should've been more related to WHAT skills you got instead of just giving you skill point bonuses. It's also not really that useful to eat stuff constantly as the AP bonuses aren't really that huge.

SMT:N's storyline's a lot more apparent if you bother talking to the NPCs and blue orby people, in any case. Frankly though I think that if it HAD been text heavy it would've come across like a sophomore in highschool trying to write about something really deep and important. Which is how I felt about FFXII (and FFT and Tales of the Abyss and um... most JRPGs, for that matter).

Also in regards to FFXII, another thing I've said before, I don't get what was so innovative about it. The particular innovation, I guess, was that it automated the battle system somewhat, but a few games have had that (Baldur's Gate 2, although I never actually used the AI scripting thing). Beyond being able to move around on the overworlds during battle, though, it pretty much is just... ATB, again.
6705  The Rest / General Discussions / Re: RPGFan Super Game Journal Turbo II - The New Challengers on: March 05, 2009, 03:33:24 AM
Beat the first mission in the Human-campaign for Disciples 2. Good stuff, but I wish you could transfer more than one of your heroes between missions.
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