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335244 Posts in 13726 Topics by 2200 Members
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586  The Rest / General Discussions / Re: RPGFan Podcast Thread on: January 18, 2013, 04:44:26 PM
I 99% disagree with Rob's point that developers should listen to fans. I'm a big fan of developer transparency and some level of community outreach, but if developers take more cues from fans then fans will feel MORE effacious and entitled (an effing disaster) and the analogy of the inmates running the asylum could apply.

Now, developers should 100% listen to sales (which they always do) and professional journalists and critics (which they sometimes do). I just think that fans should stay in the audience and not be a part of the creative process. Like, at all. Again, we don't want the inmates running he asylum.

I agree with your first paragraph, but not your second. Critics and journalists are just fans who get paid to write about games, and their opinions are just as subjective as any other fan. And I actually enjoy some degree of audience participation in the creative process. I agree that the developer needs to have a firm vision for their project and can't buckle to every bit of community pressure, but on the other hand, listening just to critics and, more importantly, sales means we'll get nothing but Skyrim and CoD-knockoffs for all eternity.
I should probably clarify - I don't think developers need to listen to fans because fans are awful as a large group.  Fans are whiners who always want everything to be just like their favorite old games, while insisting that they still want to see innovation in new games (I totally count myself among "we" by the way, I don't want to say I'm above all this).  HOWEVER, I agree that acknowledging, understanding, and addressing good criticism is valuable to developers, so I said that they should listen to professional critics and journalists.  I won't disagree that said journalists are basically fans with more access and larger audiences for their discourse, but they're also paid professionals who are much better at providing insight as to why a game is good or bad than a "toxic forum environment." 

So basically, if a game creator panders to its fans, it is likely to end really badly.  But if a game creator maintains their vision throughout game development, keeps a sound business model, and listens to advice from professionals who have a good understanding of what makes a game good, well, then they're probably going to make a pretty good game. 

And for the record, I think the best example of a team listening to its critics is the Ubisoft Montreal guys that worked on the Prince of Persia trilogy from 2002-2006.  Sands of Time was an acclaimed game whose major shortcoming was awkward combat.  Warrior Within took that criticism to heart too far, making the combat and weapon progress really interesting, but losing the voice and storytelling methods that were part of what made Sands of Time great.  Two Thrones, the final game of the trilogy, was the ultimate example of meeting halfway - it used time travel shenanigans to team up the more sarcastic, lighthearted Prince from the first game with the darker voice of the second game.  Tried to get the best of both worlds.  Sands of Time is still the best of the trilogy, but there's an obvious evolution of themes with each subsequent game. 

But let's not talk about the 2008 Prince of Persia.  Don't make me justify that ****.  I'm not going near that one with an eight-foot pole.
587  The Rest / General Discussions / Re: RPGFan Podcast Thread on: January 18, 2013, 11:39:14 AM
I 99% disagree with Rob's point that developers should listen to fans. I'm a big fan of developer transparency and some level of community outreach, but if developers take more cues from fans then fans will feel MORE effacious and entitled (an effing disaster) and the analogy of the inmates running the asylum could apply.

Now, developers should 100% listen to sales (which they always do) and professional journalists and critics (which they sometimes do). I just think that fans should stay in the audience and not be a part of the creative process. Like, at all. Again, we don't want the inmates running he asylum.
588  The Rest / General Discussions / Re: The NEW Game Journal on: January 18, 2013, 07:10:06 AM
I could wander around the world maps in Dragon Quest VIII and Skies of Arcadia FOREVER.  If Ni no Kuni is anything like those, well, I'm all about it.  Just one more week!
589  Media / Single-Player RPGs / Re: Megami Tensei Topic on: January 14, 2013, 07:37:23 AM
In their 2012 interviews the Persona guys have insisted they'll add something new and interesting to the Persona formula, but I'd be shocked if they broke the mold THAT much. They're def feeling some pressure to make just another Persona 3/4 because they were so popular. Whatever, I'm a borderline fanboy so I'll drink up the hype once they start showing it off in 2015 or whatever.
590  Media / Miscellaneous Games / Re: New Devil May Cry, bitches. on: January 14, 2013, 07:33:24 AM
The reviews surrounding the game are surprisingly positive. I might end up picking this one up sooner than I originally intended.
591  The Rest / General Discussions / Re: The NEW Game Journal on: January 11, 2013, 06:55:47 AM
My bad.  I posited it was a Tim Rogers article because I know he posted a big Skyward Sword thing around a year ago that sounded like what MGF described. 

And here's my final "list of games beaten in 2012" ->

1. Super Mario Land 2: 6 Golden Coins
2. Radiant Historia
3. Mass Effect
4. Mass Effect 2
5. Breath of Death VII: The Beginning (Hard mode)
6. Grandia II
7. On the Rain-Slick Precipice of Darkness - Episode 2
8. Mass Effect 3
9. Journey
10. The Legend of Zelda: The Wind Waker
11. Superbrothers: Sword & Sworcery EP
12. Star Ocean: Second Evolution
13. Red Dead Redemption
14. On the Rain-Slick Precipice of Darkness 3
15. Persona 3 FES
16. Final Fantasy XII
17. DeathSpank: Thongs of Virtue
18. Super Mario Galaxy
19. The Legend of Zelda: Twilight Princess
20. Fire Emblem: Fuuin no Tsurugi
21. Torchlight II
22. Rogue Galaxy
23. Atelier Iris: Eternal Mana
24. Okami
25. Civilization V: Gods & Kings
26. Valkyria Chronicles

Good year.  Didn't beat as many games as 2011 (total was 46-50 depending on how you feel about replays and fighting games), but I got a couple of big titles crossed off the ol' backlog. 
592  The Rest / General Discussions / Re: The NEW Game Journal on: January 10, 2013, 11:03:40 PM
Read an almost-interesting article on Zelda at Kotaku last night. It had some good points but devolved too much into the writer being an Old-Guard gamer who wanted Zelda to remain a hardcore series and damn the unwashed masses causing it to be dumbed down.
Was that one of Tim Rogers' big ramble-rants?  Because that guy is kind of a turd who lives for giving a few good points amidst a sea of nonsense.  He's the worst. 

Anyhow, I've been sick at home for a few days, which means a LOT of Persona 4.  I made it to the endboss of Void Quest, but then died hard (main was at level 39, everyone else level 36-38).  Level grinding now up to at least level 42. 
593  The Rest / General Discussions / Re: The NEW Game Journal on: January 07, 2013, 10:47:17 AM
OK, I like Persona 4 a lot.  It's Persona 3 with less bullshit (re: Tartarus) and heavier character arcs.  I am 100% okay with this.  I'm right in front of the boss of the Steamy Bathhouse dungeon, but I need to level grind a little bit for it since I kinda rushed through it all. 
594  The Rest / General Discussions / Re: The sports thread- 2012 edition on: January 06, 2013, 05:05:57 PM
My team won earlier today and my dad's team is looking pretty good right now!  Footbrawl!
595  The Rest / General Discussions / Re: The NEW Game Journal on: December 31, 2012, 07:50:52 PM
I originally planned to beat Valkyria Chronicles before 2013 happened, but alas 'twas not to be.  I'm on episode 14 out of 18 and company is coming over soon.  It'll be my first finished game of 2013. 
596  The Rest / General Discussions / Re: The NEW Game Journal on: December 28, 2012, 08:40:05 AM
Just finished Chapter 10 of Valkyria Chronicles.  Awesome stuff.  I leveled up two classes up to Elite and now I can use flamethrowers!?  This game just gets better and better! 

I'm leaving for a wedding in a few hours, and I won't be back until Sunday night.  That gives me two days (including one work day) to finish this game before the new year.  That's gonna be lots of videogames.  I can do this. 
597  Media / Anime, TV, and Movies / Re: Recently Viewed Movies Episode 2: The Vampire Bites Back on: December 26, 2012, 01:26:21 PM
Django Unchained is violent, absurd, full of racism, discomforting, and breathtakingly awesome.
598  The Rest / General Discussions / Re: The NEW Game Journal on: December 23, 2012, 04:11:30 PM
Playing Valkyria Chronicles and Persona 4 (regular-ass Persona 4 on the PS2).  Loving both of them.  Gonna try and beat VC before the new year (on mission 7... not sure if I can....) and Persona 4 sometime in January.  Gonna be a nice few months of gaming. 

Pokemon White 2 is on hold until MAGFest in a few weeks.  Got a few online pals that want to trade-battle in person.  Still zipping through the game with Excadrill, Haxorus, a baby Deino and that's about it.  Love those first two.  Reuniclus was put on hold so Haxorus could rip through the last two dungeons.  Serperior got benched shortly after evolving. 
599  The Rest / General Discussions / Re: The NEW Game Journal on: December 18, 2012, 03:04:27 PM
C. Platformers..... PLATFORMERS ROCK!!! I am still loving Ratchet and Clank a Crack in Time
I'm glad you're enjoying Crack in Time.  I've already made my Ratchet & Clank love evident, so I'll just give you an internet high-five and go back to playing Pokeymans. 
600  Media / Miscellaneous Games / Re: NEW MEGAMAN on: December 18, 2012, 03:02:08 PM
It's pretty good!  Bosses have interesting patterns and are modeled after their most recent movesets - Blanka uses all three types of Beast Rolls, electricity, and an electric roll, for example.  Each boss also has a super meter and super combo that can really **** you up if you aren't careful.  Using Blanka as an example again, he electrifies the entire floor (like his Ultra 2 in SF4 AE), then throws four watermelons, then Beast Rolls through the watermelons.  That's the kind of game this is. 
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