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Author Topic: Worst Final Fantasy game (No online games)  (Read 14280 times)
Eusis
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« Reply #90 on: January 08, 2012, 10:45:18 PM »

Maybe blaming XII for XIII being shit ia a bit extreme, but everything i disliked in XII was there in XIII. Shit characters, bad story, crappy music, and a lack of understanding of what their fans enjoyed in previous games. Course, the real reason I may have disliked XII so much was just because of how much I hated XII.

Last point aside, those are more like "things they're both equally weak in" than something that's directly related. XIII's cast was very different from XII's, the stories are vaguely similar at best, and the music styles are ENTIRELY different. I may as well blame SO4 for FFXIII having a terrible story as well, even though that's tri-Ace's creation and they aren't terrible in... QUITE the same ways.

And I gotta second that FFVIII's unfairly piled upon, though I may've come in with opposite expectations from most. Quite a few that cut their teeth on FFVII wanted another game like that, and a lot of the series vets were likely eager to dogpile on it being even further from the SNES titles they loved. I was more in the latter camp, but I took awhile to seriously play it, and ended up enjoying it a lot more than I anticipated. Even if I did find the story kinda dumb, but in hindsight there's some subtlety to it that most JRPGs these days wouldn't care about, even if it's more "we'll drop a million hints but never outright confirm this plot detail" than anything particularly clever.
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« Reply #91 on: January 08, 2012, 10:47:47 PM »

Touche, I guess I just really hated XII that much.
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« Reply #92 on: January 08, 2012, 11:17:27 PM »

The convenient amensia of "we all lived in an orphanage as Muppet Babies together and the main villainess took care of us but we totally forgot until this very moment" was enough to make it the only game I have rage quit because of the stupidity of the plot.

And Squall was a flat out douche.
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« Reply #93 on: January 08, 2012, 11:27:46 PM »

The convenient amensia of "we all lived in an orphanage as Muppet Babies together and the main villainess took care of us but we totally forgot until this very moment" was enough to make it the only game I have rage quit because of the stupidity of the plot.

And Squall was a flat out douche.

I thought that was fan-fiction writing at it's best/worst

You can break up the discs too...

IIRC:
Disc 1 - Missions
Disc 2 - Garden War
Disc 3 - Space Witches
Disc 4 - Time Shit

I hate dainty female characters that are made a party member but get captured (or, in Rinoa's case, go into a coma half the time), pain in the ass to level that shit.  Aeris as a character was a mean tease too back when her death wasn't a spoiler.
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« Reply #94 on: January 09, 2012, 07:33:30 AM »

My problem with VIII was that all the cool interesting shit got ignored in favor of Squall and Riona's Supermarket Romance Novel of a relationship.

There's like some sort of war going on but you don't really notice it when you're giving Riona a piggy back ride across a desert so the nice doctors over at Esthar can launch her up into space. Sure Irvine might have started out going WTF when the party shows up and nobody recognizes him or having jitters in what amounts to shooting his own mom but it's kinda difficult to pull that out of the bullshit Riona pulls with her 'Sealing Ring' that Quistis walks right into. And speaking of, whatever happened to that Quistis who was at that landing sequence at the start of the game? It seemed like right after that she wound up getting replaced with an incompetent nincompoop right afterwords but you never really notice aside from when she does stupid shit because the game forgets about her, and Sephlie, and Irvine after disk 1. And sure Laguna might have struck out with Riona's mom but one use of his Limit Break as well as some of Squall's commentary of whatever sequence you're viewing and you're basically wishing the game really was about him instead of his loser of a son.

Actually FFVIII probably does have a decent story, just one that's marred by an atrocious cast of losers that even the writers didn't really care about aside from making that Twu Wuv romance.
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« Reply #95 on: January 09, 2012, 11:43:19 AM »

XIII and XII are my favorite, guess I'm not really a FF fan.
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« Reply #96 on: January 09, 2012, 02:08:26 PM »

XIII and XII are my favorite, guess I'm not really a FF fan.

Absolutely not true. Well, at least based solely on your favorites. There is a lot of "pointless discussion" here as someone has pointed out, but it's only pointless in the sense that there is going to be no real answer (though there may be a consensus). These discussions are fun every now and then since it allows everyone to air their grievances. Our opinions are always updating, even if slowly. Though there are certainly people in the thread who can't seem to speak in a manner that isn't flamebaiting, no matter how hard they try (actually, scratch that, I know many aren't trying), the diversity of opinion is what makes these threads fun. Though, backing up why these two are your favorites might help the discussion, particularly if you see them as out of place with the rest.
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« Reply #97 on: January 09, 2012, 03:10:30 PM »

XII was very fun to play, as a game should be. It was unique in that there really wasn't a main character, the story was more about an empire, but the two kids always get blasted for being lame main characters, but they really aren't.

The battle system was more automated, but with such a large world to explore, I think it fit nicely.

XIII gets criticized for being linear, having a poor battle system, and lame characters. The characters are no better or worse than any other JRPG. People talk about how world maps allow the game to have a sense of scope...but in this game the linearity perfectly establishes the scope, a band of criminals on the run. The battle system was excellent I felt, requiring strategy and kept you engaged. How many times do people complain about JRPGs being allow about attack/heal/repeat, with no real thinking required? This game changed that formual and people still whine.

I've had more fun with these two games than games like Nocturne, an RPGfan darling which bores me frankly, which is why I rank them higher than the other FF games.
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« Reply #98 on: January 09, 2012, 05:31:34 PM »

I'm kinda with you daschrier, on FF13. It's by no means my favorite in the series, but it was fun. I think it was far less linear FEELING than FF10, which tells you at the beginning of the game exactly where you're going and gives you an idea of how long the game is, at least FFXIII keeps you on your toes. The battle system was great, and I actually really liked the characters, and at least the bits of personal dialog when they were there. The only thing that blasts it is the fucking story. What a POS! And honestly, the whole "make me go back and read journal entries to even know what the fuck is going on" thing was absolutely rediculous! I often complain about bad story telling, but this is one of the first times that bad story telling actually went as far as to impede my understanding of the story. That's actually probably my biggest complaint, even more than the quality of the story itself, the lack of attention put into actually explaining what the fuck is going on.

FF12 is just fine. I recently replayed about the first 1/2, and I quite enjoyed it. It didn't make me go "squee!" but it was an interesting experience. My biggest complaint is that lack of character that the title had: bland environments, lack of emotional connection with characters, just lack of heart all around. I found the environments to be status-quo at best, and very obvious. Even though it was far more open-ended than FF13, I found myself just walking in straight lines anyway, because there was no real joy in exploring those areas. It's probably my least favorite soundtrack in the series.

FFX. Honestly, I find it a bit overrated. I do think that it has one of the best plots in the series, and it uses some interesting storytelling devices in telling them. But the experience is marred by what I feel is the weakest cast in the series since FFV, and TOTAL linearity. Not only is it linear, but except for one deviation, it tells you exactly where you are going to be going at every step along the way. It should have been called "Final Fantasy: The Progress Bar", because that's basically what it is, You head north from one end of a continent to the other, and the game ends it's final phase when you reach Zanarkand. I don't know about most people, but I really like my surprises: good plot twists, and not knowing where it is that I'm going to need to go until shortly before hand. So, good visuals, great plot, terrible cast, abysmal exploration.

FFIX - This ties with FFVI as what I believe to be the most solid entry in the series. There's little to hate about it, and IMO, a lot to love. It encapsulates everything that a traditional Final Fantasy game should be, and does it with a child-like sense of wonder in a genre that was rapidly falling into angsty ultra-realism. One of the best casts of characters in the series, great locales, fun dialog, lots of heart and emotion, great plot that keeps you guessing and goes places you would never expect it to. Also, being the last Final Fantasy with an overworld really makes it a bitter-sweet sendoff. Great soundtrack too.

FFVIII - The one I love that everyone loves to hate. I agree that it has a lot of flaws, but for me, the flaws were things that I didn't really mind, and found myself captivated by the rest. I loved the cast, especially Squall and Rinoa (believe it or not), it had amazing locales, an interestingly-different modern-era setting, a deep, unique, and complex skill system (which everyone but me seems to hate), and probably the best visuals of the PS1 era games. It's also my favortie soundtrack in the series. The actual over-arching plot kinda sucks, but so little emotional effort is actually spent on it, that I really don't mind, I saw it as a wonderful story about a young man coming to terms with his limitations, regardless of the subpar save-the-world over-arching story.

FFVII - FF7 is a great game, but it REALLY has its ups and downs. Many long wonderful sections followed by hours of uneventfull boredom. It has a pretty good overarching story with some great twists, but starts to get a bit hippy-dippy for my tastes at times. My biggest problem with the game is that it constantly feels like it was created by a committee of marketting professionals. Time after time minigames and plot points pop up for no other reason than, "kids these days like..." (motorcycles, snowbording, dick jokes, hard-boiled guys with huge swords, ect.) And seeing at it's reception and sales, it looks like they did they were successfull. That said, it did an amazing job heralding the RPG genre into the 3D age, and standardized many visual elements that were used for years to come. It had a pretty good soundtrack (not quite as good as 6, 8 or 9s), and an engaging story with loads of exploration (me like). The greatest introduction any video game has ever had, IMO. A mixed bag that unquestionably comes out on top, but not without it's drawbacks.

FFVI - Again, one of the most SOLID games in the series, little hate, a lot to love. I've always felt that FFVI was the first truly "modern RPG". It brought the story to a depth and breadth that hasn't really changed much since. Even though it was the last 2D game in the series, it's clear that the game was visualized by the designers in 3-dimensions, sometimes to the point of being rediculously confusing on an outdated engine. The team was obviously ready to work in 3D, but didn't yet have the technology at its disposal. Even so, passion and effort that went into a game of its scope, for the time, is unmatched. Time and time delivering unique and touching moments, great dialog, and a surprisingly human story (the only game in the series with no supernatural plot element). It's the story of one horribley twisted psychopath, and his rise to infinite power. There's no demons, witches, evil spirits, or manevolent aliens calling the shots here, and I really appreciate the starkness of it all. Amazing soundtrack for using the basic sounds available at the time.

FFV - Great skill system, goofy campy story, cliche characters, and fun exploits. FFV often gets shafted for having a bad story. But honestly, people are taking it way too seriously. FFV is a goofy, campy game that knew exactly what it was and didn't try to pretend to be self-important. Where FFIV hides behind a vail of epic stoicism, when it's a ludacrus story about moon-men trying to take over the earth, FFV stands out in the open and says, "I'm corny and I'm proud!" I really appreciate that, actually. The characters, dialog, and story are typical status-quo fare for the era, and nothing to write home about. But it stands as a vehicle to lead the player onto some damned-cool dungeons and areas, a multi-planet-spanning trek the manages to have warewolves, submarines and spaceships all at the same time. It's completely rediculous, but I believe to be wonderfully fun. Lesser appreciated is the standardized interface conventions that made menu navigation a lot more manageable. Equipment and Item shops become infinitely simpler to deal with than FFIV, as did inventory management. And Final Fantasy finally decided, once and for all, how and when save points were going to occur. Where FF4 sheepeshly places them here and there, almost appologetically, FFV makes it clear where save locales are going to occur, making the era of church saving ancient history.

FFIV - I've never played FF3 (except for a few hours of the DS version), so I can't comment greatly on it's progression from previous games, but FF4 obviously did quite a bit to bring the series into the 16-bit era. It was the first game to include story and decent gameplay in the same title. There are a lot of fun elements, but it tends to take itself a bit too seriously at times, for a game that merries status-quo knights and chivelry with loopy stories of moon men and whale-shaped spaceships. It's a game that kills off every character, only to resurrect them 2 hours later, where every villain is simply a puppet of a larger villain (on and on and on), and characters turn from good to evil and back on a whim with little explanation. It's also marred by some substandard interface designs, the lack of progress bars for a time-based battle system, and a rediculously slow battle pace. But that said and done, it does offer many hours of fun entertainment, and I'm sure builds on its predicesor spectacularly.
« Last Edit: January 09, 2012, 05:38:33 PM by Prime Mover » Logged


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« Reply #99 on: January 10, 2012, 12:49:28 PM »

In the department of spin-offs how did anyone feel about "Dirge of Cerberus"? I have to tell on myself, I never really gave it a chance...... I know its not fair but I loathe shooters.... I loathe anything that even feels like a shooter.... I played DoC for roughly 20 minutes when it was first released and never looked its way again...... Have I been missing out??

Gameplay wise it's kinda bad except for the part where you're playing as Cait Sith then it's worse (stealth mission in a game barely capable of even being a 3rd person shooter let alone anything else). Story wise Vincent ends up with a 19 year old love interest who's permanently trapped in a 12 year old's body with the memories of that one chick that forked over Vincent's Death Penalty in the original game (and gave birth to Sephy apparently, I guess); the rest doesn't really get any better either so yeah, you're better off doing what everyone else does and pretend that it doesn't exist as even among that terrible compilation DoC sucks ass.

Aeolus I love your straight "as a matter of fact responses", thanks for putting this one to rest for me :) Take care
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« Reply #100 on: January 10, 2012, 08:45:23 PM »

Man the orphanage/amnesia stuff was probably one of the least egregiously dumb things about FFVIII, I think people just cling to it because most of the dumber stuff is just too incoherent to be memorable.

Here let me list stuff (Also keep in mind that I didn't like FFVIII because the gameplay was too easy to be engaging on any level, I just want to note things):

- Squall gets impaled by giant ice cone. He is later fine and this is never discussed again.

- Furry animals that evolve from Shumi help Squall break out of prison if he decides he hates his life because his blood smells like Laguna's.

- Everything involving NORG.

- Quistis' death at the missile base. Or rather the complete ass-pull deus ex machina they get it out of her with.

- Quistis ceasing to exist as a character past disc 1. It's like goddamn why not just kill her? It's not like she actually TALKED after the missile base.

- Why does Esthar even exist?

- Everything about Ultimecia.

- Actually pretty much everything on Disc 3 and onwards.

The main issue I have with basically all of these little... nonsensical points is that instead of just being random things that don't further the plot, they actually serve to retract any sort of meaningful development or growth in the characters. None of the characters are ever in a situation where they're forced to make difficult or meaningful decisions because there's always some deus ex machina or external thing that'll make it not matter.

But as I said, the worst part is Squall and Rinoa's relationship. It's completely fucked, steeped in codependence, and emotional brokeness, which wouldn't be a problem if the story was about how their relationship wasn't even remotely health, but it's not. It's glorifying it.

FFVIII is Twilight in JRPG form.
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« Reply #101 on: January 10, 2012, 09:01:43 PM »

is it weird if i think 11 is the best ff? :P also i thought A2 was terrible.
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« Reply #102 on: January 10, 2012, 09:08:28 PM »

is it weird if i think 11 is the best ff? :P also i thought A2 was terrible.

I think that most FF11 hate came from people who couldn't afford it.I thought it was fantastic.
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« Reply #103 on: January 10, 2012, 09:51:40 PM »

No, most of the hate came from people who universally hate MMOs, and are worried about the entire RPG genre slipping into being MMO only.
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« Reply #104 on: January 10, 2012, 09:56:30 PM »

Still trying to figure out why NORG is in ALL CAPS in the game I mean.
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