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RPGFan Community Quiz!
Subject: Persona 3: FES
Prize: $20 eShop, PSN or Steam code
Date: 3rd October 2014 Time: 16:00 EST
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Author Topic: What one RPG would you award 100% to?  (Read 8778 times)
Eusis
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« Reply #75 on: March 30, 2012, 11:56:40 PM »

Mass Effect i3

is that an apple product

no wait an intel processor
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MeshGearFox
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« Reply #76 on: March 31, 2012, 03:02:19 AM »

No offense, but you guys sound like you're talking out of your butts about Earthbound's graphics. Don't get me wrong, I like the game and still do. I beat a rental copy three times when it first came out and a few more times on [redacted]. Yeah, its art direction fits the game well, but FF7's has great art direction too.

Basically, Earthbound has always had crappy graphics, but now people decided they like it now because they finally realized the rest of the game is so good (which it is). Final Fantasy VII had good graphics, but over time look dated. Wind Waker (since somebody brought it up) always had good graphics, but people were too butthurt over the cell shading to realize this at first. All of these games have good art direction.

Except it doesn't. Speaking as a designer and art director, Earthbound is beautiful. And I didn't need 4 years of higher education, a degree, and 6 years of industry to tell me that. I knew that at 13 years old, because art and technical fidelity are not the same thing. FFVII had great art direction, but it has technical issues which interfere with that. Earthbound does not.

The team behind Earthbound was more than capable of making it look like Chrono Trigger or Seiken Densetsu 3. They didn't, and that was on purpose. Earthbound was meant to be whimsical and childlike. It was meant to allow for a cartoon-like level of expression (not to be confused with animated cartoons, I am talking about cartooning itself), which it succeeds in. As well, it was meant to have a surreal quality, which it also accomplishes.

I sure am happy for you that you didn't need all of your credentials to tell you all those things about Earthbound. I have pretty much all the same credentials, and I don't need them to help me make decisions about Earthbound's graphics either. I consider Earthbound's graphics average. I agree the art direction is very good, and everyone's continued belaboring of this point makes me think we're talking past each other.

Guys, guys. ALL SNES games looked like shit. Come on, they weren't even 3D.
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PotRoast
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« Reply #77 on: March 31, 2012, 10:34:52 AM »

I sure am happy for you that you didn't need all of your credentials to tell you all those things about Earthbound. I have pretty much all the same credentials, and I don't need them to help me make decisions about Earthbound's graphics either. I consider Earthbound's graphics average. I agree the art direction is very good, and everyone's continued belaboring of this point makes me think we're talking past each other.
Guys, guys. ALL SNES games looked like shit. Come on, they weren't even 3D.

There are two kinds of people in this world, those than can extrapolate from incomplete data.
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GrimReality
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« Reply #78 on: March 31, 2012, 01:22:32 PM »

Yeah, well, I have a Horticulture degree, so I am fully qualified to judge how plants appear in games! The plants in Earthbound were very plant-like!
; - )
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« Reply #79 on: April 02, 2012, 08:51:55 PM »

Well, we got 3+ pages of Earthbound talk, guess I'll pitch in, too.

When people talk about Earthbound's bad graphics, I always think they're talking about Earthbound's practically nonexistant battle animations. I mean really, every other part of the game oozes with personality, so why not the animations? Instead, they just give us stuff that most NES games put to shame. There's really no excuse for it.
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Eusis
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« Reply #80 on: April 02, 2012, 11:11:21 PM »

There's really no excuse for it.

Sure there is: memory's very limited on 16-bit carts and we only saw serious attempts towards the end of the console's life unless the enemies were small, undetailed sprites like you'd see in an action game or on the map anyway. Just look at the Final Fantasy games, none of them had animation for enemy images in battle.
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Mickeymac92
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« Reply #81 on: April 02, 2012, 11:26:34 PM »

At least your guys moved, which is more than I can say for Earthbound. Practically nothing happens on-screen in that game. Any little thing would've been acceptable. You're telling me they were so strapped for memory that they couldn't have added little sprites for when your guys do stuff at least? I don't believe it, not for a second.
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Eusis
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« Reply #82 on: April 02, 2012, 11:42:06 PM »

You're telling me they were so strapped for memory that they couldn't have added little sprites for when your guys do stuff at least?

Yes, more than I realized actually. This makes it a 3 MB game by the way.
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MeshGearFox
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« Reply #83 on: April 02, 2012, 11:44:49 PM »

Quote
Instead, they just give us stuff that most NES games put to shame.

Dragon Warrior 4 sure had some fucking amazing battle animations.

Real answer, though. Earthbound's audio files are massive. To the extent that they really did NOT have enough space for animations.
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Dincrest
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« Reply #84 on: April 03, 2012, 05:12:24 AM »

I remember this old quote.  I can't remember who said it, but here it is: "Something ugly can be beautiful.  Something pretty never can." 

I'm part of the camp, regarding Earthbound, where the whole is greater than the sum of its parts.  Graphics wouldn't get a 100% from me, but the overall experience is definitely an A. 
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Eusis
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« Reply #85 on: April 03, 2012, 05:20:00 AM »

It's also worth remembering that first person RPGs where you couldn't see your characters act WERE the norm, and it's still accepted today. I also don't really consider that a FAILING, to be that (objectively anyway) you'd need to do something like, I dunno, forget to animate characters or enemies in Mass Effect so they all look like figurines sliding around. A situation where the visuals actively try to create a scene need more attention to detail and more represented, whereas first person battles can be more of an abstraction. Especially for Earthbound, just look at those damn backgrounds.
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Themadcow
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« Reply #86 on: April 03, 2012, 06:16:34 AM »

Suikdoden's only use of 3D was on the battle screen backgrounds. It still looks better today (on a sub-32" screen) than many of the games that came out 5-10 years afterwards. The hero/Jowy unite attack is beautiful.
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Jetto
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« Reply #87 on: April 03, 2012, 09:08:18 AM »

I remember when I was playing FF7 the first time. I really enjoyed it. Beste JRPG experience of my life. However, there are a couple who have also given me lots of excitement
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Aeolus
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« Reply #88 on: April 03, 2012, 09:27:29 AM »

Suikdoden's only use of 3D was on the battle screen backgrounds. It still looks better today (on a sub-32" screen) than many of the games that came out 5-10 years afterwards. The hero/Jowy unite attack is beautiful.

The PS2 Suikodens beg to differ. Especially S3 which barely looked any better than Ephemeral Fantasia and had the clever idea of making AoE spells truly AoE by striking indiscriminately (especially in a game where the main character's True Rune consisted entirely of the Fire Element which differentiated itself entirely on the grounds of being largely AoE (fortunately none of the possible True Fire Rune recipients can use Fire magic very well except for the kid who can't use magic worth of shit in general let alone fire magic)).
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« Reply #89 on: April 03, 2012, 09:35:13 AM »

if i had to pick one it would be valkyrie profile. im a sucker for well drawn 2D sprites.
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