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Author Topic: Atelier Ayesha  (Read 24284 times)
Kevadu
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« Reply #135 on: July 02, 2013, 11:50:54 AM »

I'm also of the people that liked Rorona. Maybe because it was my first Atelier game, and like you said unsmashable_pumpkin, the story and characters are so funny I just got into the mood, so even with tank controls, barebones graphics and time limits, I got to enjoy most of it.

Tank controls?  Did I play the same game...
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Farron
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« Reply #136 on: July 02, 2013, 03:14:01 PM »

I probably expressed myself badly. By tank I was trying to say it was a little unresponsive, especially when hitting square or jumping. Anyway, at least it doesn't get in the way of the game.

That said, if you two enjoyed Rorona and don't speak Japanese to play the older titles, you really should look into Annie for DS, which was localized a few years back.

I played a little of Annie but something on it didn't click with me. Maybe it was the character or the battles. One thing I know I didn't like one bit was the music, but still I felt like there was more to it than what I had seen. Do you recommend pushing it further ?

About older titles, I do speak japanese. Not as great as I'd like to but depending on the game I can get a big part of the plot, and of all japanese games I've played (since started learning it) there was never yet a language barrier as far as gameplay is concerned. So, of the older ones, which ones would you recommend ?
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Cyril
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« Reply #137 on: July 02, 2013, 03:49:02 PM »

Violet, definitely, is the first I'd recommend.  It may spoil you, though, so another option is going by chronological release.   Marie hasn't aged particularly well, but it's still worth a playthrough eventually if you enjoy more of the organization and management (of everything).  Marie is directly connected to Elie.

Lina is pretty good too.  Definitely the best of the DS games, far and away.
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Klyde Chroma
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« Reply #138 on: July 02, 2013, 07:50:18 PM »



I'm playing Ayesha myself (a little break to play The Last of Us) but I'll get back to it. I'm liking it but so far I feel both Totori and Meruru are better so Klyde, I would try to get back at them when you think about giving them another shot.

Now, changing topics a little, since we're talking about Ayesha, am I the only one that got a little confused about the new syntheses system in Ayesha compared to the Arland games?


That first statement makes me happy. I knew it was common knowledge that Totori and Meruru were leagues beyond Rorona but to hear that, as a fan of the franchise, you appreciate them as being a cut above Ayesha... well that gets me all sorts of excited!

As for the synthesis, I have only Rorona to compare it to. Thus far, I am finding it much more enjoyable. It just feels so much more streamlined and accessible here. My problem with Rorona was that the actual synthesizing felt somehow like a menu-driven chore... and unfortunately that was in fact the vast majority of the gameplay.  Characters, art and atmosphere in all the Atelier titles I have seen are pretty much the main "draw" for me. With Ayesha here the gameplay being as enjoyable as it is makes for a home-run in my book.
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Embryon
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« Reply #139 on: July 02, 2013, 10:09:18 PM »

I'm glad to see all of the Atelier love in this thread. It seems like you guys feel similarly to the way I do-- I scored them accordingly in my reviews. :) I haven't been able to play Totori Plus, but I hear it's so similar to the original that I'm not terribly interested in playing through it again from scratch. (Especially with that lower frame rate...)
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Cyril
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« Reply #140 on: July 02, 2013, 10:12:38 PM »

Yeah, as much as I love atelier, I haven't picked up Totori plus, either.  I will be picking up Meruru plus when it's released, though.  The ability to not have Rorona screwed over no matter what you do makes it the better option.
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ferretwraith
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« Reply #141 on: July 02, 2013, 10:35:08 PM »

Hello message board of the podcast that has helped to entertain me while at work, I was hoping to sneak in a question to some fans of this series.  I know people can not speak directly to what I might enjoy, but hopefully some fellow jrpg fans will know where I'm coming from when I ask this.

If I have never had fun with, or gotten happiness out of, the alchemy system in any other rpg, would I be able to enjoy the Atelier series? (unofficially narrowed down the ones I'm interested in trying first to Meruru or Ayesha)

Nothing against the people who might like it, but systems in games such as Odin's Sphere where I have to plant seeds, to grow fruit, to make food, to increase my character's HP...  the tedium, the convoluted horror, I simply hate it.  I had no interest in the Atelier series at first, but new ones just keep being released in an era where jrpgs aren't seeing many US releases.  Is the alchemy simply significantly better than in other games less focused on it?  Should I follow my instincts and stay away from games which so clearly display item creation systems?  Perhaps worthy of note is everything else about the games look at least somewhat appealing to me.

Thanks in advance for any specific input or just general rambling on the topic should anyone respond.
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Kevadu
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« Reply #142 on: July 03, 2013, 12:22:37 AM »

Well, alchemy is a huge part of the Atelier games, so if you really hate that sort of thing then you're not going to be able to enjoy the game.  That said, I do think that the Atelier games do alchemy better than any other game I've ever played.  They actually make it interesting.  Personally I find it much more addictive than tedious.  It's fun getting better ingredients or a new recipe and seeing what you can do with it, unlocking new areas and finding new stuff there, etc.  It's all very tightly integrated into what you're doing rather than feeling tacked on.
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Cyril
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« Reply #143 on: July 03, 2013, 11:06:19 AM »

I think Kevadu really got to the point nicely, and I'll echo him in that the difference between something like this and your example of Odin Sphere is that the Alchemy system isn't something that's just tacked on or there to add more backtracking for materials.  The entire system revolves around it.  Gust has been cleaning it up and expanding on it over the course of more than a decade. It's about as polished as an Alchemy system can get.

Of course, it is very menu-driven, but you don't really need to pay attention to many of the traits at first.  It has a nice learning curve in that it's simply the more you craft the more you recognize and manipulate and play around with.  The game doesn't try to force everything down your throat at once.

Ayesha is probably the best place to start if you're really interested.  It's flexible enough, and has a focus on world building, atmosphere, and lore, compared with the other PS3 titles people tend to get into.

Or, you could try something like Mana Khemia or Ar tonelico 1/2.  Their systems are a bit older, but they're focused on something other than Alchemy and you can still get to learn if you find the system appealing.
« Last Edit: July 03, 2013, 11:07:56 AM by Cyril » Logged
Klyde Chroma
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« Reply #144 on: July 03, 2013, 02:23:01 PM »

Its funny that harboring disdain for item creation was brought up. I thought I was the only JRPG-Fan with a longstanding aversion to all things alchemy.



Or, you could try something like Mana Khemia or Ar tonelico 1/2.  Their systems are a bit older, but they're focused on something other than Alchemy and you can still get to learn if you find the system appealing.

It was actually Ar Tonelico that broke me of the prejudice toward such game mechanics.


I will contend though that, for me personally, a fine line exists between monotony and addiction when it comes to item crafting.  If I can quickly and compulsively sail through menus and throw crap togeather like I am spamming an "attack" option, I tend to enjoy it a wee bit more than say if I really must scour lists and carefully choose ingredients and wait through lengthy "craft" animations.

That said, while I loved Odin Sphere for other reasons, certain gameplay elements of that title got under my skin. Plant growing to pad out my inventory being one my grievances with the title.

Ayesha allows crafting at warp-9 if you so choose although conversely it seems being thoughtful and "picky" is also sometimes necessary (or beneficial) when crafting. The result for me is a craft system that can easily chew up chunks of my time without regret as I watch my alchemy level go up, up and away! LoL
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ferretwraith
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« Reply #145 on: July 06, 2013, 03:09:43 AM »

Interesting, Ar tonelico 2 was going to be the next game I purchased before SMT IV forced me to buy a 3ds, immediately adding many hours to my backlog as I haven't owned a handheld system since the gameboy color.  I had bought ar tonelico 3 used, accepting that I may have just wasted money on some sort of unplayable lolita sex romp... apart from some clearly stupid portions such as crystal innuendo, I ended up getting maybe ~40 hours of fun and ~9 hours of "how is this game not over yet" out of it.  Since that was considered "the bad game" in the series, I was definitely interested in trying "the good one."

However, I don't know that I understand what this game would have to do with relieving hatred for alchemy?

The logic in my head goes gust developed the atelier series > gust also developed ar tonelico > gust put the atelier series alchemy into the first 2 ar tonelico games (but said screw it for the third?) > ar tonelico is more enjoyable than the atelier series if the player hates alchemy, but! > the alchemy is in fact so good that it could inspire a player to get into an entire series focused on this crafting system they were just exposed to.

Is this accurate?
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Klyde Chroma
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« Reply #146 on: July 06, 2013, 02:06:10 PM »

ar tonelico is more enjoyable than the atelier series if the player hates alchemy, but! > the alchemy is in fact so good that it could inspire a player to get into an entire series focused on this crafting system they were just exposed to.

Is this accurate?

That is more or less what proved to be true for me although I would be hesitant to suggest superiority of the AT games to the Altelier franchise, AT is however a distinctly different "flavor" if you will. A flavor you may have a greater taste for if more traditional JRPGs (particularly in regard to plot and characters) is what you are used to/seeking.

 In my case however it was Ar Tonelico NOT Ar Tonelico 2 that converted me. I state this specifically because I thoroughly enjoyed AT more than its sequel. I will say AT 2 did have a cool and addicting battle system... however even that got stale in the wake of how easily broken the game became as I progressed.

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« Reply #147 on: July 06, 2013, 02:12:17 PM »

I think ArTone 2 and Atelier Ayesha..... why do these games have so much chatter?  God, all I remember half the time was reading text -- then scrolling through it to move it on.

It seems to "style" of music in ArTone games is living on passed the title itself.
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Cyril
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« Reply #148 on: July 07, 2013, 02:27:01 PM »

I'd say they aren't necessarily overly heavy in comparison to the rest of the series.  Did you play Iris 1?  Every time you enter a store and after about half of the crafts with them you'd get into a conversation.

Shopkeeper conversations and character development were a pretty big part of the earlier games.  If there's anything that most of the PS3 titles have neglected, this is it.  It seems to me it's more that they, er, rearranged where conversations take place.
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Zendervai
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« Reply #149 on: July 07, 2013, 02:28:45 PM »

I assumed with Meruru they were cut down because the shopkeepers were mostly the same people as in Rorona and Totori. But there were a ton of conversations with them in Meruru anyway. Pamela even had a weird pseudo-romantic subplot reverse harem thingy going on.
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