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Author Topic: Zero Escape: Virtue's Last Reward  (Read 16370 times)
ZeronHitaro
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« Reply #45 on: October 24, 2012, 11:18:20 AM »

Interesting that you think VLR is more difficult than 999, Zeron, because I find the puzzles in VLR to be a lot less obtuse.  Do you need scratch paper? Sure, but few of them leave you with a "WTF am I supposed to do?" feeling like I got in 999.

The only time I ever had a WTF moment in 999 was that massive library puzzle. Maybe for some reason all of 999's logic just clicked for me where VLR's just isn't on the same wave my thought process travels. Probably because I do far, far better with number puzzles than I do color puzzles. Heck I can't even grasp the basic color fusions this Nonary Game runs on. Digital Roots and Base-9 were so much easier to comprehend. >.<

I.E: There's a puzzle in VLR in what's basically the
Code:
Decompression Chamber; Tenmyojin Path, First Ally
room. It's the very last one where you have to input 3 numbers into a panel with the "." ".." and "..." symbols that has something to do with color progression on a piece of paper and the different colors appearing in the different sectors on the outline of an 8 on a scanning device. Even on easy mode, no matter how many times the puzzle was explained to me I utterly failed to grasp any of the logic that goes into solving it. Literally I failed it so many times the partners just finally told me the answer outright. ~_~ It was extremely vexing and almost a little insulting that the game grew tired of me trying to learn its trick. Even more so since you can't just 'shut off' easy mode once you activate it if you honestly don't want the answer given to you for free.

Granted that's the only one so far but I have a hunch it won't be this game's last. ~_~
« Last Edit: October 24, 2012, 12:32:57 PM by ZeronHitaro » Logged
John
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« Reply #46 on: October 24, 2012, 12:27:14 PM »

Then maybe we are just on different wavelengths, because that puzzle was easy for me - I got both the secret and the regular passwords almost immediately.  But as I said, 999 had some vexing puzzles for me.  Still, I like the fact that despite the fact that it's much more expansive, VLR feels more "compact" because there's not an obscene amount of exposition.
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Eusis
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« Reply #47 on: October 24, 2012, 12:29:33 PM »

Friendly warning, but I hear the IGN review has some mild spoilers in it. Still, nice to see almost everyone gushing.
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ZeronHitaro
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« Reply #48 on: October 24, 2012, 04:54:11 PM »


Code:
Wait...'To Be Continued...'? Time-line sensative ending extensions? Damn you Aksys you crafty jerkwads! XD
I thought with the new Flow System I'd be rid of these things. Though truth be told even these are really, really
well implemented.

So two character endings down and about 3-4 flat out bad endings...and I still have a serious nitpick with the story:

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Why the hell is Clover so Betray-happy? For someone who's played in [i]now three[/i] Nonary Games
shouldn't she of all people know the 'Be a dick' option never ends well in these things.
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ZeronHitaro
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« Reply #49 on: October 26, 2012, 11:00:04 AM »

Alright, need some help. I ask here because I don't want the 'answer' like a cheat site would give. I just need a 'hint' that the game is refusing to give me.

This is for the Path: Double Luna, Double Ally

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On this path the game suddenly expands into a whole hidden branch of gameplay;
however unlike other sections that have done this so far there is no 'Lock' that has appeared
on my FLOW chart. I've gotten to the point where Sigma and Phi are in the Director's Office
and Sigma 'thinks' he knows the password and ID to access the computer. I took several guesses
and all were wrong. I've tried looking at the flashbacks they give you prior and can't figure out anything
from them. Even after backing out and getting a 'To Be Continued' this pathway is not marked
by a 'Lock'; which displays even if you already have a solution to a pathway that seems to require
Morphogenic Field knowledge.

So the hint I need is as follows:

Is the ID and PW something I will have as an Archive item?
Something I should've written down from a different path (since he implies I've seen it already)?
Is it something Sigma will just tell me outright when I progress down the right path?
Or did I not look closely enough during the flashback sequence?
(I saw the whole 'Memento Mori' 'Remember Death' things floating up)
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John
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« Reply #50 on: October 26, 2012, 11:15:13 AM »

As spoiler-free as possible:

Code:
You don't have the answer.  Go do the other paths first.
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ZeronHitaro
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« Reply #51 on: October 26, 2012, 11:31:57 AM »

I kinda figured that was the case; just wanted to make sure because I'm hyper-analytical and would've likely spent a few hours banging my head away over every potentiality. XD So thanks.

Still super weird that there's no
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Lock
on that FLOW selection. Wonder what makes that one so special.
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ZeronHitaro
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« Reply #52 on: October 26, 2012, 04:32:52 PM »

Finished clearing pretty much everything from the Yellow and Red door trees except for
Code:
the hidden ID/PW point (which I now have the PW for; but not the ID) and Lock #3
(which is weird because I'm pretty sure one of the other paths I've played has the 'right answer' but the game seems to think not)
.

Started a bit of Blue and just cleared the first puzzle room before stopping. This game really can't be played for more than a few hours at a time; need breaks to absorb all the info. XD Still I'm amazed I've sunk nearly 17 hours into this thing and still have a ways to go. It's all good thus far but I admit I'm starting to feel the first traces of drag/burnout. The ratio of answers to questions isn't quite balanced enough to keep the desire for the 'real ending' as high as I'd like. Will still beat the game but I think it'll easily be a few more days; if not half a week.
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John
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« Reply #53 on: October 26, 2012, 04:45:56 PM »

I think you're getting a little bit of the same burnout I did.  When you hit the 3rd major branch, you start getting some repeat information and not enough of what you're getting is answers.  Once you get close to the end of that 3rd branch, though, things pick back up significantly.
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ZeronHitaro
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« Reply #54 on: October 28, 2012, 07:39:58 PM »

Wait...they didn't...

Code:
Yep; they pulled the 'Lawl; buy our next game in two+ years if you want the full story' nonsense.
Here I thought after 999 Aksys was a bit above that. :-\ That...honestly kinda ruins the game just
a little for me. If I get hooked into a story I prefer to finish it from start to end. I don't watch trilogies
if I don't have all three parts. I don't read series novels until I have all the installments. Ect.

This is just kinda...cheap and underhanded. *sigh* Not sure how much of the story I'll even remember
in 2014 (or 2015 if they're slow) or if I'll even still have the game around for a refresher. The way they have it set up, unlike 999,
you're pretty much going to have to have Virtue's Last Reward fresh in your mind to know what's going on.

Maybe I'll feel better once it all settles in but for right now...low blow Aksys. Low blow.
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Eusis
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« Reply #55 on: October 28, 2012, 07:56:59 PM »

Wait...they didn't...

Code:
Yep; they pulled the 'Lawl; buy our next game in two+ years if you want the full story' nonsense.
Here I thought after 999 Aksys was a bit above that. :-\ That...honestly kinda ruins the game just
a little for me. If I get hooked into a story I prefer to finish it from start to end. I don't watch trilogies
if I don't have all three parts. I don't read series novels until I have all the installments. Ect.

This is just kinda...cheap and underhanded. *sigh* Not sure how much of the story I'll even remember
in 2014 (or 2015 if they're slow) or if I'll even still have the game around for a refresher. The way they have it set up, unlike 999,
you're pretty much going to have to have Virtue's Last Reward fresh in your mind to know what's going on.

Maybe I'll feel better once it all settles in but for right now...low blow Aksys. Low blow.

One quick thing: don't blame Aksys. They're only the US publisher, I doubt they have any real say in what happens with the game.
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Ramza
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« Reply #56 on: October 28, 2012, 08:15:30 PM »

AHHH so many black boxes I want to highlight. NEED THIS GAME
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ZeronHitaro
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« Reply #57 on: October 28, 2012, 09:25:47 PM »


One quick thing: don't blame Aksys. They're only the US publisher, I doubt they have any real say in what happens with the game.

Ahh, go fig that's what I get for trying to use anything more generic than 'writer's.

Still...

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I think I've finally pinned down why this ending sucks so much. There's no 'closure' to any part of the story.
All you know is the general 'why' everything happened. But everything else is still unresolved. You haven't escaped; you're
suffering the 'Megaman Trigger Fate'. You don't know anything about Radical-6's release. This very much feels like one hell of
a 'Prologue' chapter. Basically it's what would happen if Higurashi had been nothing but Question Arcs with little to no
Answer Arcs.

Unlike other forms of multi-part media there's no bandage to help with this form of 'wound' either. The story is not self-contained;
say like the Harry Potter novels where sure there's a ton of questions for the other 6 books but at the end of Sorcerer's Stone you
pretty much know all you need to about that particular 'episode' as it wraps up. Unlike films there is no knowledge of 'The next part
has either already been filmed and is slated to release next year' or 'Production has already started on the sequel'. I mean yeah you
can assume it has in this case but there's nothing 'solid' out there to confirm it. There's just...nothing; which is sorely needed if you
ever feel the desire to just cleave off a no-resolution plot like this.
« Last Edit: October 28, 2012, 09:31:21 PM by ZeronHitaro » Logged
Eusis
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« Reply #58 on: October 28, 2012, 09:33:50 PM »

Ahh, go fig that's what I get for trying to use anything more generic than 'writer's.

Writer may be more applicable in this case, but if you want it more generic you just need to dig up the original developer/publisher, in which case it's (Spike) Chunsoft.

Anyways, it does kind of feel like that
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it's going for that sort of impromptu trilogy thing Hollywood's done for the last decade or so, with a complete first installment
then followups that are basically two halves of a story. Still, there was indication in the Answers on the 999 site that Akane and Santa
had bigger plans and the events in 999 may be but a prelude to them. And at least we got some closure with Junpei and Akane, though
it wouldn't surprise me an alternative outcome popped up in the events in the sequel.
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ZeronHitaro
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« Reply #59 on: October 28, 2012, 10:22:02 PM »

True; on the more nitpicky side of things though I have to honestly wonder:

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Assuming the games follow their 'core identity pattern' does this mean Vol 3. is going to feature yet
another Nonary Game? Personally I think its inclusion in this one was almost a stretch. Almost superficial
since the focus was more on the Ambidex Game with anything 'nine' related really being little more than
superficial. But in the end it roughly makes sense since it was Akane orchestrating most of this; so I can
understand why the general terms 'rolled over' into this one (Nonary, Zero, ect.)

But from what the story says here Akane seems to have no idea what happened in the Nevada Test Facility;
aside from what Sigma-Zero, Failed Timeline Attempt has told her. Meaning if they do another 'Nonary Game-
Whatever Edition' in Volume 3 there's going to be even less reason for it. The original Zero's in jail, Akane has
nothing to do with the NTF incident, 'maybe' Santa could be involved but I highly doubt it. He would've kept
Akane in the loop at the least and at the most I doubt he'd unleash a world-ending plague.
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