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Subject: Persona 3: FES
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Date: 3rd October 2014 Time: 16:00 EST
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Author Topic: RPGs / Visual Novels / etc. on Nintendo DS?  (Read 9480 times)
Aeolus
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« Reply #30 on: November 24, 2012, 02:56:10 AM »

Each game has an annoying sequence, so I don't think that's too Capcom-exclusive.
Ocarina of Time has Dampe's grave and the "childhood arc" dungeons, Majora's Mask has "the first 3 days", Twilight Princess has the Sacred Grove (*groan* twice), Wind Waker has sailing and Forsaken Fortress (which is one big stealth sequence aside from when you're thwacking an enemy with a giant stick), Skyward Sword has you doing three laps around the Hyrule track ... and Adventure of Link is one big long annoying sequence.

Yeah, there's tedium in every game, but those don't grind your game to a halt until you do them (aside from the MM and WW's FF ones) like Tokay Island and the Goron Dancing do. Also you complain about OoT's Dampe and the YL dungeons but not getting the fourth bottle?

Then again, maybe I shouldn't have all caps the "REALLY" in my previous post. Well either way, it's too late to edit it now.
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Dice
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« Reply #31 on: November 24, 2012, 03:03:46 AM »

Tokay island sucked balls.  It's not bad when you know what to do... but I'm all new-age-y now and I can't stand Link's general walking speed in those old games.  I'll give you that.  Goron dancing I barely remember, but I remember having a save stuck at that part for a bit.... oh... that and in Seasons where that fucker has to repair the Balance Stone (or whatever) and needs to have a minecart en route to crashing into it while enemies come at you.... that was the weirdest and stupidest thing a game has had to ask you to do.

I never bothered with the 4th bottle in OoT... 3 is usually enough and I'm no completionist.

Speaking of Link
http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/article/1288553--dad-hacks-classic-legend-of-zelda-game-to-make-the-hero-into-a-heroine
URL says it all, I thought this was a nice gesture.  Kinda wish they do it more with "blank slate" characters.  I'm sick of playing as a dude, though I never really understood the "it makes *you* the lead!" angle of silent characters.
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Aeolus
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« Reply #32 on: November 24, 2012, 08:09:03 AM »

Tokay island sucked balls.  It's not bad when you know what to do... but I'm all new-age-y now and I can't stand Link's general walking speed in those old games.  I'll give you that.  Goron dancing I barely remember, but I remember having a save stuck at that part for a bit.... oh... that and in Seasons where that fucker has to repair the Balance Stone (or whatever) and needs to have a minecart en route to crashing into it while enemies come at you.... that was the weirdest and stupidest thing a game has had to ask you to do.

I never bothered with the 4th bottle in OoT... 3 is usually enough and I'm no completionist.

The walking speed isn't the problem, its the fact that you're running through a convoluted fetch quest, which includes at least one dumb minigame, over a small island to get your gear back, and you can't even leave or do something relevant to complete, or even access, the next dungeon. The dancing Goron is both a rather strict rhythm minigame that you need to complete twice to access the rest of the mountain/the next item in that location's fetch quest for one of two keys needed to enter the next dungeon (actually the whole Rollin' Ridge segment was a slog since it was mostly wall to wall minigames of varying quality).


Quote
Speaking of Link
http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/article/1288553--dad-hacks-classic-legend-of-zelda-game-to-make-the-hero-into-a-heroine
URL says it all, I thought this was a nice gesture.  Kinda wish they do it more with "blank slate" characters.  I'm sick of playing as a dude, though I never really understood the "it makes *you* the lead!" angle of silent characters.

Don't know why he bothered when he could've tracked down the official hack i.e. http://zelda.wikia.com/wiki/BS_The_Legend_of_Zelda, but I guess it's the thought that counts.

As for the issue of silent male leads that you get to roleplay, it pretty much stems from JRPG designers believing that only Japanese high school aged boys play them hence them typically being dumb as bricks, that have absolutely no say in matters, terrible fashion sense, no personality, and the depth of a blank sheet of paper. Of course even if they weren't silent or lacking in a personality they'd still be teenaged males because there's no stale, overplayed, play-it-safe, cliched MC archetypes for females (except for the ones who either operate their dainty stores and only moonlight as an adventurer, dress up in their skimpy magic girl outfit as they battle evil magic girls in even skimpier outfits, or are too busy trying to garner the attention of her romantic interest/the male lead to be effectual in any meaningful capacity) or anyone over the age of 21.
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« Reply #33 on: November 24, 2012, 02:42:43 PM »

Don't forget the 'hey go collect a hundred million zillion rupees that your wallet can't hold so I can translate Triforce charts for you" sequence in Wind Waker. I hated that part.

Generally speaking, though, I don't like 3D Zelda and find the entire games to be 'annoying sequences.' I made it to the Triforce chart section in Wind Waker, and beat Skyward Sword. SS was FULL of 'annoying sequences.' I hate OoT and have never been able to get through that game, it just felt like such a damn slog to me. The 2D ones (especially the Capcom ones and LttP) seemed to abandon that "BIG ADVENTURE SO WE MUST SEND YOU ON ALL MANNER OF ANNOYING TASKS BEFORE YOU CAN GET TO THE DUNGEON' pretense, but it's been a long time so I may not remember as well.
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« Reply #34 on: November 24, 2012, 03:12:09 PM »

Generally speaking, though, I don't like 3D Zelda and find the entire games to be 'annoying sequences.' I made it to the Triforce chart section in Wind Waker, and beat Skyward Sword. SS was FULL of 'annoying sequences.' I hate OoT and have never been able to get through that game, it just felt like such a damn slog to me. The 2D ones (especially the Capcom ones and LttP) seemed to abandon that "BIG ADVENTURE SO WE MUST SEND YOU ON ALL MANNER OF ANNOYING TASKS BEFORE YOU CAN GET TO THE DUNGEON' pretense, but it's been a long time so I may not remember as well.

You are a very, VERY brave soul, I give you that!
 
(Okay, okay, we're all adults here so I don't expect that to start up a lot of shit, but at other gaming forums I could see a ten page firestorm following.)

Thread duty:  Like many others I also highly recommend 999 and Hotel Dusk.  There's plenty of stuff out there, though, as some others have noted.  The DS is an RPG and graphic novel beast.
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« Reply #35 on: November 24, 2012, 04:57:05 PM »

As for the issue of silent male leads that you get to roleplay, it pretty much stems from JRPG designers believing that only Japanese high school aged boys play them hence them typically being dumb as bricks, that have absolutely no say in matters, terrible fashion sense, no personality, and the depth of a blank sheet of paper. Of course even if they weren't silent or lacking in a personality they'd still be teenaged males because there's no stale, overplayed, play-it-safe, cliched MC archetypes for females (except for the ones who either operate their dainty stores and only moonlight as an adventurer, dress up in their skimpy magic girl outfit as they battle evil magic girls in even skimpier outfits, or are too busy trying to garner the attention of her romantic interest/the male lead to be effectual in any meaningful capacity) or anyone over the age of 21.

Okay, and does any of that relate to Zelda?
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« Reply #36 on: November 24, 2012, 05:14:13 PM »

As for the issue of silent male leads that you get to roleplay, it pretty much stems from JRPG designers believing that only Japanese high school aged boys play them hence them typically being dumb as bricks, that have absolutely no say in matters, terrible fashion sense, no personality, and the depth of a blank sheet of paper. Of course even if they weren't silent or lacking in a personality they'd still be teenaged males because there's no stale, overplayed, play-it-safe, cliched MC archetypes for females (except for the ones who either operate their dainty stores and only moonlight as an adventurer, dress up in their skimpy magic girl outfit as they battle evil magic girls in even skimpier outfits, or are too busy trying to garner the attention of her romantic interest/the male lead to be effectual in any meaningful capacity) or anyone over the age of 21.

Okay, and does any of that relate to Zelda?

Is this strictly about Zelda?
I think Dice mentioned silent MCs and he replied to it?
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« Reply #37 on: November 24, 2012, 08:08:10 PM »

As for the issue of silent male leads that you get to roleplay, it pretty much stems from JRPG designers believing that only Japanese high school aged boys play them hence them typically being dumb as bricks, that have absolutely no say in matters, terrible fashion sense, no personality, and the depth of a blank sheet of paper. Of course even if they weren't silent or lacking in a personality they'd still be teenaged males because there's no stale, overplayed, play-it-safe, cliched MC archetypes for females (except for the ones who either operate their dainty stores and only moonlight as an adventurer, dress up in their skimpy magic girl outfit as they battle evil magic girls in even skimpier outfits, or are too busy trying to garner the attention of her romantic interest/the male lead to be effectual in any meaningful capacity) or anyone over the age of 21.

Okay, and does any of that relate to Zelda?

Is this strictly about Zelda?
I think Dice mentioned silent MCs and he replied to it?

It's about as on-topic as most of Aeolus's rants.

Seriously, though, I've always thought silent protagonists were more popular in the west than in Japan anyway.  Can we blame that on Japanese teenagers too?
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Aeolus
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« Reply #38 on: November 25, 2012, 03:43:19 AM »

As for the issue of silent male leads that you get to roleplay, it pretty much stems from JRPG designers believing that only Japanese high school aged boys play them hence them typically being dumb as bricks, that have absolutely no say in matters, terrible fashion sense, no personality, and the depth of a blank sheet of paper. Of course even if they weren't silent or lacking in a personality they'd still be teenaged males because there's no stale, overplayed, play-it-safe, cliched MC archetypes for females (except for the ones who either operate their dainty stores and only moonlight as an adventurer, dress up in their skimpy magic girl outfit as they battle evil magic girls in even skimpier outfits, or are too busy trying to garner the attention of her romantic interest/the male lead to be effectual in any meaningful capacity) or anyone over the age of 21.

Okay, and does any of that relate to Zelda?

Is this strictly about Zelda?
I think Dice mentioned silent MCs and he replied to it?

It's about as on-topic as most of Aeolus's rants.

Seriously, though, I've always thought silent protagonists were more popular in the west than in Japan anyway.  Can we blame that on Japanese teenagers too?

Admittedly my beef with generic protagonists doesn't really stem from the Zelda series despite Link's silence, mostly due to the general lack of verbosity within Zelda games (outside of those annoying "you got 5 rupees for the first time this session" messages or companions in general). It also doesn't really stem from WRPG protagonists either since those are typically player created anyways (also there are much fewer silent WRPG protagonists these days). It mostly stems from games that only have a silent protagonist in name only as your party members or whomever spends the majority of the game putting words in your mouth and turning every Y/N choice into a 'but thou must' or a 'way to derail the topic; now I have to spend a textbox getting back on track'.

That said, yeah, I probably shouldn't have derailed the topic like I did. It's just that all the good recommendations have already been made at this point.
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« Reply #39 on: November 25, 2012, 06:47:34 AM »

Apparently saying the magic word "Zelda" on these forums sparks discussion faster than a dancing dog wearing a tophat... Amusing. It really makes me want to try one since every Zelda -fan seems to be so passionate about it.

But that'll have to wait. I just got Hotel Dusk: Room 215 and Radiant Historia should be on it's way.

Anyways... if one of these days I would pick up any Zelda game that DS can run, what would be a good starting point? Should I start from the earliest game so I don't miss anything or just jump to the latest installment?
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« Reply #40 on: November 25, 2012, 10:13:28 AM »

Spirit Tracks takes place after Phantom Hourglass and Phantom Hourglass takes place after Wind Waker (Gamecube), but there isn't anything that would be confusing. Both of them have unique villains that never show up anywhere else and the only thing you really need to know after Wind Waker is that the characters are sailing around looking for a new country.
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« Reply #41 on: November 25, 2012, 12:36:39 PM »

The DS (Lite) can play Game Boy Advance games, so if that's the type of DS you got, you could also try The Minish Cap or better yet, A Link to the Past. That last one is the 2D Zelda game that pretty much everyone loves. Or just pick the game with the 'gimmick' that you find the most appealing. Spirit Tracks has a train, A Link to the Past has you travel between two worlds, The Minish Cap lets you shrink to a tiny size, and Phantom Hourglass has a boat and seacharts that unlock new areas.
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« Reply #42 on: November 25, 2012, 02:24:50 PM »

Apparently saying the magic word "Zelda" on these forums sparks discussion faster than a dancing dog wearing a tophat... Amusing.

Is very well known that in gaming forums talking about Zelda or only mentioning Ocarina of Time can cause a meltdown.
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« Reply #43 on: November 25, 2012, 05:52:47 PM »

If you mention Zelda on tigs it pretty much dominates that thread/chatroom too.

Zelda's just a thing, ya know?
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