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Subject: Persona 3: FES
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Date: 3rd October 2014 Time: 16:00 EST
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Author Topic: Should I replay FFX or wait for the remake?  (Read 2581 times)
Taelus
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« Reply #15 on: March 29, 2013, 04:37:56 PM »

I think FFV has one of the most enjoyable combat/character-building systems in the series. Give it a nice little makeover with some 3D and make the dialogue less patently absurd, and you could have a nice little portable JRPG to have some fun with. I'm also not a huge fan of FFIV in general, and was surprised by how much I enjoyed the remake, all things considered. I'd be very happy to see one done for V-- and if they get Matrix to do it, it could even be as purty as Bravely Default!
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« Reply #16 on: March 29, 2013, 05:24:57 PM »

I don't get why so many people wanna see remakes. New ips would be so much better.
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Aeolus
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« Reply #17 on: March 29, 2013, 05:53:47 PM »

I don't get why so many people wanna see remakes. New ips would be so much better.

I've seen their new IPs. I'd rather have the remakes.
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« Reply #18 on: March 29, 2013, 05:57:14 PM »

I don't get why so many people wanna see remakes. New ips would be so much better.

I've seen their new IPs. I'd rather have the remakes.

QFT
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Taelus
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« Reply #19 on: March 29, 2013, 06:16:22 PM »

I like remakes and new IPs and have no problem with either. I've enjoyed many of their new IPs, and just as many of their remakes and ports.
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« Reply #20 on: March 29, 2013, 06:56:02 PM »

I've seen their new IPs. I'd rather have the remakes.

What, you want to the 3DS and Vita to be like the DS and PSP again with a ton of remakes of SNES games? We already got that and I'm became very tired of it.

...though if SQEX do remakes of Final Fantasy IX and Vagrant Story, then they have my curiosity.
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« Reply #21 on: March 30, 2013, 12:35:01 AM »


The difference between this and a FFVII remake is like the difference between fixing up a car and building a whole new car from scratch from already existing blueprints.

Whelp, you got me there. I was somewhat proud of my analogy but yours puts it to shame. I guess I'm just a little bitter because I feel like the differences in graphics aren't significant enough to warrant a whole new release on the PS3 and Vita.

...but knowing me, I'll probably still get it. Haha!
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Aeolus
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« Reply #22 on: March 30, 2013, 07:22:54 AM »

I've seen their new IPs. I'd rather have the remakes.

What, you want to the 3DS and Vita to be like the DS and PSP again with a ton of remakes of SNES games? We already got that and I'm became very tired of it.

...though if SQEX do remakes of Final Fantasy IX and Vagrant Story, then they have my curiosity.

Honestly though, the question itself basically amounts to "Do you want to die of AIDs or Cancer?" Both methods are slow, agonizing ways to go, while one choice offers a glimmer of hope and the other offers no hope at all.

Besides, those DS remakes finally enabled me to get a chance to play games that didn't make it out of Japan the first time like Dragon Quests V & VI and Front Mission 1. Any one of those games was more entertaining to me than FFXIII-2 or anything Kingdom Hearts.
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Klyde Chroma
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« Reply #23 on: March 30, 2013, 03:06:50 PM »



Honestly though, the question itself basically amounts to "Do you want to die of AIDs or Cancer?" Both methods are slow, agonizing ways to go, while one choice offers a glimmer of hope and the other offers no hope at all.


You know your serious about your games when you draw comparisons like that-LOL

Thats why I love your posts Aeolus! A priceless analogy if ever I read one!! This thread is chalk full of good verbage actually...

On that note, my two cents on the matter...

When it comes to Square Enix I must say I could be excited about remakes or new IPs given the project in question. The problem is, that on either front, they have failed my expectations miserably. There are still so many 16-bit era games that have not seen the light of day  outside of japan (save fan translations for roms to play via emulation) that  I would LOVE to see remade and localized. Yet instead we get more IOS incarnations of final fantasies that are already available on multiple platforms.

And when it comes to new IP's I simply just want to see something new pioneered in the genre of the JRPG, on home consoles, to restore some faith... I don't even care if it sucks... I'll buy... I swear, its like square enix forgot what made them so popular to begin with...

At the end of the day, regardless of whether we are talking remakes or new games altogeather, I simply DON'T want to hear "final fantasy" unless there is a "type-0" (won't ever happen) or a "6" (probably won't ever happen...) attached to it.
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« Reply #24 on: March 30, 2013, 06:04:50 PM »

Honestly though, the question itself basically amounts to "Do you want to die of AIDs or Cancer?" Both methods are slow, agonizing ways to go, while one choice offers a glimmer of hope and the other offers no hope at all.

Sure...

Besides, those DS remakes finally enabled me to get a chance to play games that didn't make it out of Japan the first time like Dragon Quests V & VI and Front Mission 1. Any one of those games was more entertaining to me than FFXIII-2 or anything Kingdom Hearts.

I understand that point of view. All I said was that I became tired at one point of seeing SQEX drowning itself in its old glory in the DS and PSP era with all those remakes.

Then again, I have seen a bunch of Squaresoft fans in the past never really giving much of a fuck what SQEX does because everything is horrible all the time in comparison to the golden SNES era when they were kids or teenagers so whatever. *shrug*
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« Reply #25 on: March 31, 2013, 10:47:16 AM »

Well, the problem is that the new stuff hasn't been working for me lately. I loved every FF up until FFXI (no interested in MMOs). Didn't enjoy FFXII and the great automated battle and lame Vaan shoehorned in. Didn't enjoy the rail-running do-nothing-but-fight-and-watch-cutscenes-of-emo-people FFXIII, didn't enjoy it-doesn't-make-sense-so-it-must-be-a-paradox! (then is the whole GAME a paradox?) FFXIII-2, going to pass on FFXIII-3, no interest in FFXIV (MMOS again), etc, etc, etc.

They didn't bring out FF Type 0 or Bravely Default, two Square games I was looking forward to.

The ONLY new Square game I have enjoyed since FFX was FF:Dimensions. That's it. Everything else..... meh.

But I did enjoy playing some of the remakes on the handhelds, would pick up FFX and get some sweet love for my Vita.
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« Reply #26 on: March 31, 2013, 07:54:57 PM »

If Bravely Default doesn't show up at E3 then everyone can push the panic button.

Regarding the situation with Type-0, you can read something about it here.

Didn't enjoy the rail-running do-nothing-but-fight-and-watch-cutscenes-of-emo-people FFXIII

The "emo people" part doesn't make much sense to me... I mean, I never saw any of the characters portraying their emotions in a narcissistic manner saying that their suffering is so great that no one can understand their pain, or something to that effect.

And besides even if it does has "emo people" like you say, FF has almost always have melodrama in their stories so why do people get mad now?

didn't enjoy it-doesn't-make-sense-so-it-must-be-a-paradox! (then is the whole GAME a paradox?) FFXIII-2

There's enough exposition in the dialogue and text for anyone to understand the story.
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« Reply #27 on: March 31, 2013, 10:34:22 PM »

The reality is, it might be quite simple to convert an SD 3D game into an HD one. When you create a model in a 3D graphics engine (as I'm learning with 3DS Max) you're not creating ever single polygon from scratch, you're usually creating more complex shapes, and then defining settings on how smooth and complex the processing on the model will be. So you create a sphere, which could have an infinite amount of polygons if you wanted it to, and then you set how complex it is based on what you wish your processing load to be. The engine behind Final Fantasy X likely works in a similar way, it's sent a bunch of mathematical models, and then set at a certain level of complexity that the PS2 can handle.

I'm not saying it's as easy as going in and changing a couple of parameters and calling it good... we're probably talking about changing parameters on every 3D model, for starters. But it's FAR easier than creating a bunch of models from scratch. Texture resolution is probably even simpler. Most 2D graphic designers create graphics in far higher definition than the final outcome will be, because they can, and just in case. Especially since HD was right on the horizon during FFX creation, you can be sure the texture artists were creating fairly high resolution raster, or even simpler, lots of vector graphics, in which resolution means nothing anyway. THAT would be just as simple as re-converting all of the texture files from their original Photoshop, Illustrator, or whatever created them files, and saving over the old ones. I mean, in this case, we really are talking dead stupid easy processes. Similarly, the games 2D graphics would already be higher resolution, probably including the pre-rendered 3D models (which quite a few interiors were).

If you plan ahead, you can create a game for any resolution and processing level, and in fairly short order, switch it over at a fraction of the time/cost it would take to create a new game. You can be sure that the type of engine used to create FFX is only a small difference between the engines of today. FF7 on the other hand, would be a completely different matter, using totally different kind of graphics, with probably no thought in planning for high resolution (since that wasn't even on the horizon). The models weren't simplified down from more complex mathematical functions, you can tell they were build from the ground up to be simple. It really wouldn't be any easier to convert FF7 than it would be FF6, in each case, you'd basically have to re-create the game.
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« Reply #28 on: March 31, 2013, 11:40:52 PM »

If Bravely Default doesn't show up at E3 then everyone can push the panic button.

Regarding the situation with Type-0, you can read something about it here.

Didn't enjoy the rail-running do-nothing-but-fight-and-watch-cutscenes-of-emo-people FFXIII

The "emo people" part doesn't make much sense to me... I mean, I never saw any of the characters portraying their emotions in a narcissistic manner saying that their suffering is so great that no one can understand their pain, or something to that effect.

And besides even if it does has "emo people" like you say, FF has almost always have melodrama in their stories so why do people get mad now?

didn't enjoy it-doesn't-make-sense-so-it-must-be-a-paradox! (then is the whole GAME a paradox?) FFXIII-2

There's enough exposition in the dialogue and text for anyone to understand the story.

Re: FFXIII - true, it wasn't so much the melodrama, but more like that is ALL you got to see. At least other games you had some interaction with the characters and NPCs and exploring towns to break things up. This game just felt like it was two extremes. I actually didn't mind the characters and the story part, but there were times where I just felt disconnected because I got so tired of the rail feeling. FFX has a similar rail but at least it was broken up by towns, fayth puzzles, and exploring sidequests.

Re: FFXIII-2 - I could follow it, but it still felt like they were making up crap and instead of making it make logical sense, its a paradox. I felt other games did time travel much better. And I didn't finish this one (first FFF I could say that for, but I lost enthusiasm for finishing it after I heard it didn't really end very well - unless you want DLC).
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Aeolus
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« Reply #29 on: April 01, 2013, 01:50:07 AM »

If Bravely Default doesn't show up at E3 then everyone can push the panic button.

Regarding the situation with Type-0, you can read something about it here.

Didn't enjoy the rail-running do-nothing-but-fight-and-watch-cutscenes-of-emo-people FFXIII

The "emo people" part doesn't make much sense to me... I mean, I never saw any of the characters portraying their emotions in a narcissistic manner saying that their suffering is so great that no one can understand their pain, or something to that effect.

And besides even if it does has "emo people" like you say, FF has almost always have melodrama in their stories so why do people get mad now?

didn't enjoy it-doesn't-make-sense-so-it-must-be-a-paradox! (then is the whole GAME a paradox?) FFXIII-2

There's enough exposition in the dialogue and text for anyone to understand the story.

Re: FFXIII - true, it wasn't so much the melodrama, but more like that is ALL you got to see. At least other games you had some interaction with the characters and NPCs and exploring towns to break things up. This game just felt like it was two extremes. I actually didn't mind the characters and the story part, but there were times where I just felt disconnected because I got so tired of the rail feeling. FFX has a similar rail but at least it was broken up by towns, fayth puzzles, and exploring sidequests.

Re: FFXIII-2 - I could follow it, but it still felt like they were making up crap and instead of making it make logical sense, its a paradox. I felt other games did time travel much better. And I didn't finish this one (first FFF I could say that for, but I lost enthusiasm for finishing it after I heard it didn't really end very well - unless you want DLC).

My beef with FFXIII's melodrama wasn't that there was melodrama but that the characters are barely that. There's no real depth to any of them, yet the way they go on is trying to evoke emotions from players, which doesn't work since the players aren't invested in them. You never get a sense of anybody's life pre-events of the game. Instead, you start in the action, then after a few hours of gameplay and a couple of hours of cutscenes you're treated to a couple of cutscenes that has Lightning standing in a building talking to Serah-chan or Snow which doesn't reveal anything more than a knife and some marriage and other meaningless tidbits, or Vanilla leaning over Dajh doing something suspicious and again little else, or anything that has to do with that stupid fireworks festival which is like The Host levels of character interaction and everybody's there for some useless reason. But none of these cutscenes develop the characters at all beyond their one dimensional archetypes, if anything, they only reinforce them. And the game's handling of their growth away from them is just as hamfisted if not more so since its basically you coming up to a point then suddenly "WE'RE ALL PETS!!!" :byodame: or "Nah. I'm not going to gank you after all because I've decided to stop being a bitch." or "Hi. I'm supposed to be this major antagonist that dogs the players throughout the game, but instead I get three cutscenes before I'm force lightninged to death by my Space Pope who is also a Robogod because the dev team wasted all of their time on artwork, engine creation, and writing up complicated mythologies to cram into the datalog to bother implementing an in-battle model for me.".

Basically there's nothing that really hooks the players to the characters, which makes all the melodrama that surrounds these characters meaningless and rather obnoxious/intrusive/ham-fisted.

FFXIII-2 is by-the-numbers protagonist Sora Oh No~el! Christ going on a magical time travel adventure with his good buddy Serah-chan to save his old boyfriend slash godmodded martystu Riku Gaius Baltar and girlfriend slash perpetually dying of anime cancer over and over again Kairi (insert random Christmas related terms here because I cannot currently recall what's-her-face's name was but its most likely along these lines) from themselves or fail miserably trying because everything's a goddamn paradox. Also Paradoxes, I do not think it means what Squeenix thinks it means.
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