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Subject: Persona 3: FES
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Date: 3rd October 2014 Time: 16:00 EST
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Author Topic: XBOX: A New Generation Revealed, May 21st  (Read 30199 times)
Klutz64
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« Reply #180 on: May 24, 2013, 09:40:59 AM »

So, I guess Microsoft is giving some of the proceeds of used game fees to publishers and/or retailers? Which explains why retailers are still hyping this thing up?

In other words, there is a Bond Villain somewhere high up over at Microsoft.
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dyeager
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« Reply #181 on: May 24, 2013, 10:43:15 AM »

http://dubiousquality.blogspot.com/2013/05/xbox-one-one-last-post-then-no-more.html?utm_source=feedly
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Aeolus
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« Reply #182 on: May 24, 2013, 11:00:45 AM »

http://gematsu.com/2013/05/rumor-xbox-one-used-game-trade-ins-detailed

Sounds convoluted and only really profitable for Microsoft.
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Yggdrasil
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« Reply #183 on: May 24, 2013, 11:43:57 AM »

The Final (mini)Bosman - Go Home, Xbox -- Source: GameTrailers

CONTENT CONTENT CONTENT
EXPERIENCE(s) EXPERIENCE(s) EXPERIENCE(s)

:V

Also this post on gaf that I liked before was updated.


Interesting.
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Klutz64
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« Reply #184 on: May 24, 2013, 02:53:28 PM »

Come to think of it, did anyone ask Sony what *their* attitude toward used games is going to be. Because if they confirmed used games will be business as usual on the PS4, then I have a feeling the relationship between Microsoft and Sony is currently along the lines of:

"B-b-but you said we were gonna do this TOGETHERRRRRR! You cheated! Cheater!"
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Yggdrasil
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« Reply #185 on: May 24, 2013, 04:45:42 PM »

News & Videos:

BN301Xbox-One-Voice-Control_delivery_v3 -- TheOnion, YouTube

Xbox Juan -- YouTube

Rumor: Xbox One has remote play, talking Kinect -- Gematsu

FYI, The Xbox One Voice Commands Weren't in Real-time -- IGN Middle East

Xbox One and used games -- Xbox Live's Major Nelson

Come to think of it, did anyone ask Sony what *their* attitude toward used games is going to be.

Sony & used games: a recap of comments sofar & why we may already know their strategy -- NeoGAF
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Yoda
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« Reply #186 on: May 24, 2013, 07:18:00 PM »

I think one thing needs to be clear... there's no way xbox and ps4 will have a different take on used games.
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Eusis
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« Reply #187 on: May 24, 2013, 08:40:53 PM »

I think one thing needs to be clear... there's no way xbox and ps4 will have a different take on used games.

Sony's bigger in markets where used games are a bigger deal and Microsoft can do this partially because of their infrastructure. It actually sounds to me like doing this is too much of pain for all but really really big web/tech companies, and Sony's only got half of that covered.
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Chronix112
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« Reply #188 on: May 24, 2013, 09:22:12 PM »

I think one thing needs to be clear... there's no way xbox and ps4 will have a different take on used games.
It would be absolute suicide for that DRM policy to be released on the ps4 in Japan.
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Aeolus
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« Reply #189 on: May 24, 2013, 11:32:03 PM »

I think one thing needs to be clear... there's no way xbox and ps4 will have a different take on used games.

I suspect that they will take different paths (though neither will remain as it currently is), and the real matter hinges on which side do the retailers take.

Kinda like the HD-DVD versus Blu-Ray formats last generation.
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MeshGearFox
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« Reply #190 on: May 25, 2013, 12:00:11 AM »

Hypothetical scenario:

Game X is really cool but has a short print run, so the used market value for the discs stays highish.

But then you also have to pay the original retail value.

In other words, congratulations, every used game now costs 100 dollars, split fifty/fifty between the retailers and activation fee. And now there's a premium on getting XBox Piracy going because the games are now impossibly expensive.

Easy purchase, easy installation, and lower prices from lower overhead are all viable approaches to combating piracy. Making your product needlessly difficult to buy is just going to ensure that /nobody buys it./

(Also, Betty White's Masturbation Coach. Better with Skinect).
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Chronix112
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« Reply #191 on: May 25, 2013, 12:11:49 AM »

A home run post from another forum I am a member of.

"Here's my analysis, post-research.

If you have nothing solid to say about your console, donít reveal your console. This isn't magical insight gleamed from a crystal ball here. Just donít do it until itís ready! And for all these policy ideas regarding the system which you're playing around with, don't leak them only to preform a soft semi-retraction a tweet or two later. This is basic PR 101 here people, hell, it's Sun Tzu,

ďIf you know the enemy and know yourself, you need not fear the result of a hundred battles. If you know yourself but not the enemy, for every victory gained you will also suffer a defeat. If you know neither the enemy nor yourself, you will succumb in every battleĒ

Replace "enemy" with "customer" and "battle" with "fuck you" and you pretty much get the idea of why they have their heads up their asses.

If they thought ANY of these stupid ideas would fly with consumers, then they obviously donít have any idea how a customer-based industry works, and I could run their company better.

For one, don't advertise your game console as a Smart TV Box - that's what any gamer ever would describe as a feature not the purpose of the machine. If it is the purpose of the machine, don't call it X-Box. Video gaming is not an afterthought in this context, not something you mention halfway in as a feature to your totally awesome fantasy football Skype machine. Secondly, if you have nothing to show your core audience, then show nothing and postpone it until you have SOMETHING of substance to show. We (read non-XBOX fanboys) were ever-so-pissed-off that there was nothing to talk about here except the aforementioned nebulous rumours of doom and our reaction to them was OMGWTFBBQYOUBASTARD S because there's nothing for us to love here. If you want consumers to ignore the stick you intend to wallop them with you've got to have one hell of a shiny carrot dangling there. Thirdly, donít make a console dependent on something that can see or hear you all the time; For one, it's goddamn creepy, for another thereís privacy concerns to think about. I don't think we believe in the infallibility of network security if we ever did, and that's a lot of trust were putting into a corporation which I frankly lack in every regard. What if their servers got hacked or MS decides to do market research and generally use your Kinect to go big brother on your ass?

This is not quantum mechanics here people, this is common sense and basic respect for the audience you intend to sell your shit to. And the fact that a lot of people at Microsoft never thought of any of these things tells me thereís a good number of people in the Xbox development team that deserve to be fired.

As to what they've released thus far. I will tentatively address them under the assumption that they may change (but probably not, again, assholes).

Why should I care about daily internet requirement?

I personally spend several weeks during the year in a place without internet connectivity, I know people who have no stable internet connection (shock of shocks) who still enjoy gaming as a hobby. It doesn't benefit me at all as a consumer while inconveniencing me unnecessarily.

It is not just about internet connectivity. Its also about being completely tied down to a network like this. With this everything is tied to XBL, and if it fails so does every single console sold regardless of having a proper high speed internet connection. What happens when the servers get shut down like original Xbox live? Will we just have abandon everything we invested in because we simply wonít be able to use it anymore? Will we be required to buy Xbox-two to keep what we've earned and payed for?

Those are the issues that come from a ďfeatureĒ or rather system requirement like this.

Used/loaned/traded/rented game restrictions.

On a personal note, I have done all of the above. In fact, I've as many used games as new. This is one perk for a console gamer that PC gaming can't replicate. However, companies like Steam have gotten far better at adjusting their pricing to meet consumer demand. What are the chances that MS are going to keep prices inflated to maintain their cut? I want a reason to buy a console and making them more PC-like is not the solution, particularly when your half-way through the system's life cycle and superior gaming computers are being released for cheaper.

A great deal of assurance in shelling out 60$ for a new game, is that you can trade it in for a percentage of the expense later and buy more games. While I agree that some aspects of the used market should be changed, like returning games the same month of purchase to flood the market with slightly cheaper used copies during the important game launch, I buy games months or even years after the release well after it has much tangible benefits to publishers. After all, it might make me want to buy their next game all the more.

The XBOX one basically reduces itself to glorified and vastly overpriced rental system. You donít own anything, you are just spending a lot of your money to rent a game for a really long time, and when the network drops your rental period ends.

New restrictions on independent games

Xbox Live does not allow independent developers to self-publish anymore, forcing them to go through MS for everything. This to me is worst  of the worst here. The XBLA was the main point of differentiation that made Xbox a gamers system. After all they're putting these little guys with innovative ideas out there on a marketplace where they're seen and can get paid for their work, creating some absolute gems and opening up gaming in new directions for the console market.

Well, now Sony and Nintendo are that, where MS was years ago. Just fuck MS.

Edit: And X-Box One... really? Really? That's what you went with? Was this seriously focus-grouped or something, I can't think of anyone saying it's a good name. It's a minor quibble, but added into the whole presentation it's just symptomatic of the utter lack of polish they put into it. Not that X-Box was a super-cool name or anything, but it was unique like the Wii, this is just confusing."
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Kevadu
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« Reply #192 on: May 25, 2013, 12:31:36 AM »

Hypothetical scenario:

Game X is really cool but has a short print run, so the used market value for the discs stays highish.

Thankfully this is one scenario that's on its way out.  In the next gen it's going to be normal to have everything available digitally (not necessarily only digitally, but at least as an option), so you ought to always be able to get a new copy that way at least.  Meaning nobody is going to be shelling out $100+ for a used disc just because there's no other way to get it.
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Taelus
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« Reply #193 on: May 25, 2013, 01:47:46 AM »

Great article, Dave. Couldn't have said it better myself. It's 100% anti-consumer-- we get NO advantage. The only entity that "wins" in this hypothetical is Microsoft, and I can't imagine that win will be without cost.
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« Reply #194 on: May 25, 2013, 02:21:07 AM »

So the fact is that the Wii-U and 3DS will be the only game consoles fully backwards compatible that will play used games.

I always considered Nintendo machines my secondary consoles but it looks like 3DS will be my primary console with Wii-U as my secondary.

Strange times.
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