Author Topic: The Legend of Zelda Topic (BotW DLC 1 June 30th, DLC 2 later on)

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Aeolus

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Re: The Legend of Zelda Topic (Latest: Majora's Mask 3DS released!)
« Reply #75 on: February 17, 2015, 11:25:19 AM »
I actually don't know if I got anything from the Bombers this time.  They give 'rumours' now as part of helping new MM players along. 

I also realized I missed that friggen quest after clearing Woodfall to get a bottle.  Is it worth redoing the temple?  IIRC, I'm gonna have to for at least another quest coming up...but maaan that's kinda lousy they "incomplete themselves" again...

And yay, looking forward to completing this place.  Mind you, with so few temples I do like how much "opens up" with each of them beaten.  And respawning Dodongos has been an excellent and easy revenue stream since Goron's can punch their tail till dead in three hits.  Also, not to correct you, but the Bunny Hood can be gotten even before you finish Woodfall (if you were gonna do another playthrough).  That thing made the Deku Butler race a breeze.

I already decided doing three days worth of Deku Playgrounding isn't gonna happen, so there's my incomplete heart piece there (there's always one in each game I don't really feel like putting the effort in for).

The Deku Playground does suck.

As for the Bunny Hood, at least in the original, you got it by marching all the chicks into Cuccos over at the Cuccos Ranch off to the side of Romani Ranch (it's also right next door to the Dog Races). Though, making the Bunny Hood available earlier would be a significant boon to transportation times. its available with most of the rest of the Ranch on Day Three as I forgot that the not-Carpenter will clear the road, only Epona and the sidequests relating directly to Romani and Cremia can't be accessed prior to the Powder Keg (fine then, strike Bunny Hood off my previous list of things that open up after Snowhead and add Chateau Romani instead).


Also congrats on your five finger post-count Dice. May you never have to hear me make a binary joke about your post count again.
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Re: The Legend of Zelda Topic (Latest: Majora's Mask 3DS released!)
« Reply #76 on: February 17, 2015, 03:29:33 PM »
I'm about three quarters of the way through with the MM remake, and I'm not terribly enthused with it.  The quality of life changes are pretty good, but the game seems like it's lost its soul in the wake of the visual upgrade.  I don't know if it a lighting thing or what, but everything looks entirely too cheerful and cartoonish.  The original was always bright, but in a more garish, psychedelic sense that made you realize that you had legitimately stepped through the looking glass.  It's like everything in this version is too...polished and scrubbed, I guess.  I don't know how else to put it.

I don't really see why they redesigned the boss battles, either.  The boss in Snowhead bummed me out in particular.  Having to stop and plink arrows at an eye now just sucks the momentum out of that fight.

The more I play, the more I wish I was playing a straight port.

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Re: The Legend of Zelda Topic (Latest: Majora's Mask 3DS released!)
« Reply #77 on: February 18, 2015, 04:06:50 AM »
I'm about three quarters of the way through with the MM remake, and I'm not terribly enthused with it.  The quality of life changes are pretty good, but the game seems like it's lost its soul in the wake of the visual upgrade.  I don't know if it a lighting thing or what, but everything looks entirely too cheerful and cartoonish.  The original was always bright, but in a more garish, psychedelic sense that made you realize that you had legitimately stepped through the looking glass.  It's like everything in this version is too...polished and scrubbed, I guess.  I don't know how else to put it.

I don't really see why they redesigned the boss battles, either.  The boss in Snowhead bummed me out in particular.  Having to stop and plink arrows at an eye now just sucks the momentum out of that fight.

The more I play, the more I wish I was playing a straight port.

I actually kinda agree.

Old school N64 Zelda games were excellent because, funny enough, they weren't advanced.  It relied on a lot of black colouring (as opposed to atsmophere-filled rooms pouring colour into everything), poor textures, empty and bland fields, and so on.  Basically, it lacked a lot of "life" and atmosphere and colour that made the worlds look so much more....spooky my comparison than their modern version.



The janky quality of old 3D can... surprisingly work to its advantage because it IS off-putting and lifeless.

I'm actually still a little bitter they didn't opt for the "black shadow" filter used in the original and very aesthetic MM art:


That said, the original game really, reaaallly looks like butt these days.  The Goron Races were an absolute eye soar before, and I don't think even as a port it would fly these days.  The 3DS's enhanced textures and detailing the entire world over really do look beautiful that I often find my eye wandering.  All in all, I think I blame the lighting more than the graphics, the bright colours do sort of 'change the mood' of what is really a very tragic and dark installment for the Zelda series.  If anything, the only time they should have taken more liberties was with the Moon itself (and the special five minutes before "it all ends").

Furthermore, I really do like some of the changes:
= Song of Double-time just saves precious REAL WORLD time.
= Perhaps to the jargin of some, the Stone Mask is in a less convenient place
= The Bomber's Notebook is more easily received
= Anju's room fuckup is a bit more understandable now
= I think it was just smart to swap the Woodfall and Snowhead Great Fairy Prizes given how much magic you use up between the two of them.
= That stupid Deku Land Deed plant's animation was annoying (yeah I get it's supposed to be, but c'mon).
= The gyroscope is again a wonderful addition (especially for bow and arrow heavy sections); it makes segments a bit too easy, but I think it's one of those where I'd rather easy > annoying.
« Last Edit: February 18, 2015, 12:41:39 PM by Dice »
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Andrew

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Re: The Legend of Zelda Topic (Latest: Majora's Mask 3DS released!)
« Reply #78 on: February 18, 2015, 04:47:18 AM »
I totally disagree about the graphics; I think the improvements are awesome in basically every way. The comparison shots from Dice show exactly that.

The game is about the same as I remember it - good, but definitely not as good as the best in the series (OoT, ALttP, Oracles - IMO). I'm curious as to whether some of the fanatical fans who have been asking for the remake for years now are disappointed now that they actually remember what the game is like. Don't get me wrong though, I am enjoying it and it is a good game.

Something about the world design has always rubbed me the wrong way though. I can't really put my finger on it, but Woodfall/Snowhead/Great Bay/Ikana Canyon feel a bit... jumbled, maybe? Like they're not laid out in the smartest way. Clock Town is great though.



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Re: The Legend of Zelda Topic (Latest: Majora's Mask 3DS released!)
« Reply #79 on: February 18, 2015, 01:03:55 PM »
Something about the world design has always rubbed me the wrong way though. I can't really put my finger on it, but Woodfall/Snowhead/Great Bay/Ikana Canyon feel a bit... jumbled, maybe? Like they're not laid out in the smartest way. Clock Town is great though.

I get that too.  I'm not sure if it's because it reuses so much from OoT that this "other world" talk doesn't really cut it as an excuse.  Or if it was intentionally weird. 

But level design definitely felt strange for the N64 era in general (have you played Mario 64 recently??  Same deal).  Still, the Zelda games did 'alright' when it came to dungeons, and so far I've had a good time there (I've heard bad things about Great Bay though, and Stone Tower is pretty 'infamous' as far as Zelda Dungeons go).

I love Termina Field.  Certainly it's not hard to one-up OoT's rather bland hub to begin with (even though it's still fun to just ride Epona around it though); but between the perfect divisions of everything, Clock Town being at the centre of it all, and the secrets and amount of 'clutter' it has, I think it's cool because it's so unconventional.
The actual areas themselves...yeah, they do feel kinda "jumbled", caught between good ideas but a bad layout (where OoT definitely shined better per individual area).  I already mentioned getting to Snowhead Dungeon involved a ton of zig-zagging around, while Woodfall meant hopping and (as Aeolus mentioned) doing a reduxed version of OoT's sneaking into the castle...but easier since Deku peeps can't see more than 8 feet away from themselves.

And don't get me wrong, I do love the graphical upgrade.  I love that Link actually resembles the artwork these days.  And his smile (for his 'item get' pose) actually looks like a big genuine smile :D more than this :>
It was probably the first time I really noticed and appreciated the changes:


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Aeolus

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Re: The Legend of Zelda Topic (Latest: Majora's Mask 3DS released!)
« Reply #80 on: February 18, 2015, 01:17:49 PM »
(I've heard bad things about Great Bay though, and Stone Tower is pretty 'infamous' as far as Zelda Dungeons go).

From what I've heard, it isn't the Temple itself that's the problem, its what they've done to the Zora Mask.

As in, it now functions more like the Goron Mask in terms of transportation, except the speed you're used to in previous versions is now the dash (that now burns meter). I can only imagine it making certain stretches really annoying since you're not going any faster but you're now under added pressure to get there faster (though I suppose it might help with the Pirate's Den stealth sequence, not that said sequence really needs the help, players can easily navigate it just by taking their time).

To be fair though, what they apparently did to the Giant's Mask is goddamn hilarious.
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Dice

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Re: The Legend of Zelda Topic (Latest: Majora's Mask 3DS released!)
« Reply #81 on: February 18, 2015, 01:25:05 PM »
(I've heard bad things about Great Bay though, and Stone Tower is pretty 'infamous' as far as Zelda Dungeons go).

From what I've heard, it isn't the Temple itself that's the problem, its what they've done to the Zora Mask.

As in, it now functions more like the Goron Mask in terms of transportation, except the speed you're used to in previous versions is now the dash (that now burns meter).

Won't lie, Goron's mask is AWESOME.  If it ain't super strong then I love just rolling around Termina's main hub and restocking everything after a new time cycle. :P

But yeah, the Zora mask feels pretty slow and, unlike the Goron mask and Snowhead, there aren't as many bushes to get magic pots from.  I JUST got to Great Bay, so I'll see if the slower speed is better when up against Pirates and the Dungeon.
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Re: The Legend of Zelda Topic (Latest: Majora's Mask 3DS released!)
« Reply #82 on: February 18, 2015, 02:37:28 PM »
I've never played this one and I'm really looking forward to the 3DS version.
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Re: The Legend of Zelda Topic (Latest: Majora's Mask 3DS released!)
« Reply #83 on: February 18, 2015, 03:01:46 PM »
Something about the world design has always rubbed me the wrong way though. I can't really put my finger on it, but Woodfall/Snowhead/Great Bay/Ikana Canyon feel a bit... jumbled, maybe? Like they're not laid out in the smartest way. Clock Town is great though.
.  

But level design definitely felt strange for the N64 era in general (have you played Mario 64 recently??  Same deal).  Still, the Zelda games did 'alright' when it came to dungeons, and so far I've had a good time there (I've heard bad things about Great Bay though, and Stone Tower is pretty 'infamous' as far as Zelda Dungeons go).

I think that's true, there's definitely some levels of SM64 that are a bit roundabout. Though a lot of the level design is awesome. The pinnacle of level design for that console, in my eyes, is Banjo-Kazooie (ironically with Conker's Bad Fur Day as some of the worst).

I am actually not a big fan of Termina field. I think maybe it is the strict quarter layout that makes it feel weird for me - it doesn't feel like a real field. I guess it must be nostalgia, but I actually quite like Hyrule Field in OoT. I agree it's a bit bland, but I always felt it did an awesome job making you feel like you're really travelling from place to place, something Termina doesn't manage.



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Re: The Legend of Zelda Topic (Latest: Majora's Mask 3DS released!)
« Reply #84 on: February 21, 2015, 07:17:37 AM »
(I've heard bad things about Great Bay though, and Stone Tower is pretty 'infamous' as far as Zelda Dungeons go).

From what I've heard, it isn't the Temple itself that's the problem, its what they've done to the Zora Mask.

As in, it now functions more like the Goron Mask in terms of transportation, except the speed you're used to in previous versions is now the dash (that now burns meter). I can only imagine it making certain stretches really annoying since you're not going any faster but you're now under added pressure to get there faster (though I suppose it might help with the Pirate's Den stealth sequence, not that said sequence really needs the help, players can easily navigate it just by taking their time).

Just did most of this section today. The Zora mask definitely feels weird; I found it a bit unwieldy most of the time. Running out of magic is a pain too, because it renders you basically useless if you're trying to do a lot of swimming, especially because of those damn respawning skeleton fish. Unlike the Goron Mask which, sure, if you run out of mana you're reduced to slow walking, but you still pack a punch and can also take off your mask and be regular Link, a convenience that isn't available to you underwater.

Still feeling the jumble, too. Great Bay is back and forth and back and forth and back and forth, made worse by no fast way to get across the beach unless you can be bothered calling Epona. I tended to unmask and put on Bunny Ears.
« Last Edit: February 21, 2015, 07:21:38 AM by FlamingR1ft »



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Re: The Legend of Zelda Topic (Latest: Majora's Mask 3DS released!)
« Reply #85 on: February 22, 2015, 12:50:46 AM »
btw what are the New 3DS exclusive features? I've tried googling it and I don't get productive results.
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Re: The Legend of Zelda Topic (Latest: Majora's Mask 3DS released!)
« Reply #86 on: February 22, 2015, 11:50:01 AM »
btw what are the New 3DS exclusive features? I've tried googling it and I don't get productive results.

Camera control with the extra analog. :P
(remember, I think, the Oracle Games gave you an extra shop for playing the GBC game on the GBA?  THAT was really kinda cool)

(I've heard bad things about Great Bay though, and Stone Tower is pretty 'infamous' as far as Zelda Dungeons go).

From what I've heard, it isn't the Temple itself that's the problem, its what they've done to the Zora Mask.

As in, it now functions more like the Goron Mask in terms of transportation, except the speed you're used to in previous versions is now the dash (that now burns meter). I can only imagine it making certain stretches really annoying since you're not going any faster but you're now under added pressure to get there faster (though I suppose it might help with the Pirate's Den stealth sequence, not that said sequence really needs the help, players can easily navigate it just by taking their time).

Just did most of this section today. The Zora mask definitely feels weird; I found it a bit unwieldy most of the time. Running out of magic is a pain too, because it renders you basically useless if you're trying to do a lot of swimming, especially because of those damn respawning skeleton fish. Unlike the Goron Mask which, sure, if you run out of mana you're reduced to slow walking, but you still pack a punch and can also take off your mask and be regular Link, a convenience that isn't available to you underwater.

Still feeling the jumble, too. Great Bay is back and forth and back and forth and back and forth, made worse by no fast way to get across the beach unless you can be bothered calling Epona. I tended to unmask and put on Bunny Ears.


I'm doing a write up for MM, and yeah, Great Bay is probably the weirdest area and the Zora Mask took a pretty big hit.  I do thing that I'd be grateful for the slowdown if I knew what it was like to ALWAYS be going fast, but the amount of times I'd rather just be going fast outweighs that.  I think the respawning skeletal fish is so stupid too.  THey probably should have got RID of all item buttons and made each mask with unique controls (not like you're going to be using Link's arrows as a Zora, right?) and made one of those the "electric shield" buttons.
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Re: The Legend of Zelda Topic (Latest: Majora's Mask 3DS released!)
« Reply #87 on: February 22, 2015, 03:07:01 PM »
Yeah, that's not a bad idea, really. Would have made more sense. Great Bay is basically home of annoying respawning enemies: fish in the water and leevers on the beach. Such a pain.

I'm in Great Bay Temple now, and I'd forgotten how frustrating it is. And now you can't freeze water anywhere! That makes me a bit sad.



Aeolus

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Re: The Legend of Zelda Topic (Latest: Majora's Mask 3DS released!)
« Reply #88 on: February 22, 2015, 08:24:45 PM »
Yeah, that's not a bad idea, really. Would have made more sense. Great Bay is basically home of annoying respawning enemies: fish in the water and leevers on the beach. Such a pain.

I'm in Great Bay Temple now, and I'd forgotten how frustrating it is. And now you can't freeze water anywhere! That makes me a bit sad.

Can you freeze anything at all? Because I remember a lot of puzzles depending on freezing and unfreezing water.

As for the Great Bay enemies, the Bone Fishes' biggest problem was the fact that they were mostly invisible until they were on top of you (which you just beam shielded and moved on), while the Like-Likes' biggest problem was being glacial moving mounds of health (which to be fair, has been a series tradition dating back to the NES Original, though they were faster in that).
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Re: The Legend of Zelda Topic (Latest: Majora's Mask 3DS released!)
« Reply #89 on: February 22, 2015, 09:25:59 PM »
You can now only freeze small areas of water that sparkle. Enemies can still be frozen though.