Author Topic: Nier 2 for PS4

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Agent D.

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Re: Nier 2 for PS4
« Reply #165 on: March 22, 2017, 02:14:40 PM »
Pleased to say you're incorrect! "Counter Chip - Move toward an enemy attack with perfect timing to counter it. (250% counter damage)"
Ok, let's establish all the facts. Counter does NOT give you a parry, it increases the damage done during a counter. A counter is achieved (so far that i can surmise) from executing a parry or a perfect evade and attacking from that state immediately. Now the actual question answered...

To execure a parry, you actually move towards you opponent as their attack is about to land. So as their punch is about to smack you in the face, push the analog stick in the direction they are coming at you from and you will smack them away and leave them vulnerable to a counter attack.

Proof of the parry...https://youtu.be/fBUc45ibKP0

I found the explanation off reddit for how to do it. Now I'm not 100%sure that the counter works on the perfect evade as well, even though it's a counter attack (and any of those counter attacks I land generally 1 shot enemies now), it may just be for parrying, but until I test it again (which I won't be anytime soon, time for Mass Effect), I can't confirm it. Anyways, question has been answered, parrying is not from a chip.

TASTY!

Ramza

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Re: Nier 2 for PS4
« Reply #166 on: March 23, 2017, 09:26:56 PM »
tooting my own horn...

If Christian theology is interesting to you, even if you don't subscribe to said religion (i.e. -- issues of grace, of what makes "choice" and "autonomy" real things) -- you may appreciate this piece I wrote for gamechurch.com on NieR Automata

http://gamechurch.com/redemption-song-grace-and-suffering-in-nier-automata/

Arvis

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Re: Nier 2 for PS4
« Reply #167 on: March 24, 2017, 10:26:06 AM »
I should probably have played Automata before reading that though, eh, @Ramza ?
"You know, you're pretty cool too, Arvis.  You like good music, good games, and good tennis." - Divingfalcons

Ramza

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Re: Nier 2 for PS4
« Reply #168 on: March 24, 2017, 05:12:42 PM »
I should probably have played Automata before reading that though, eh, @Ramza ?

The piece is written with virtually no spoilers. There's only one thing in there that might be thought as such, but it was in the promotional materials for the game for months prior to release.

ironmage

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Re: Nier 2 for PS4
« Reply #169 on: March 27, 2017, 09:13:11 PM »
And I'm done.  All endings clear, including the good one, [L].
Final score:  'damn fine game' / 10.  Numerical scores are nonsense.
Thoughts below.  I'm not going to spoil any major plot points, but if you think that knowing which characters are playable is a spoiler...well, stop reading.
Stop reading now.
Last chance.
...
...
...Okay, then.

Gameplay:  This is the general concept of Nier polished to a mirror shine.  Fluid, fun, addictive, and with more than enough variety to keep it interesting.  Although, as with Nier, I didn't find the need to use more than a couple of the spellspod programs.  I could find few flaws.  More than once during this game, I thought to myself "there are a lot of ways they could have screwed up the camera, here".  But unless I did something dumb like lock onto an enemy, and then try to walk away, the camera was pretty much spot-on.

Graphics:  Others here have already gushed enough about 2B's animations, so I'll just say I'm an A2 fan, and leave it there.
Whoever was responsible for modelling waterflow in this game deserves a bonus.  Not just the waterfalls, but the pattern of light flickering over a streambed.  And if you find yourself in a particularly dark area, try playing around with aiming the pod lamp.  It can produce some extraordinary silhouettes.

Writing:  The world-building is incredibly creative, and many of the individual story episodes are extraordinary.  However, the main plot lacks the strong personal motivation present in Nier, and I didn't find the main characters particularly compelling.  2B never really strayed from the kuudere type, and 9S simply wasn't very interesting (I liked his operator, 210, better). A2 had potential, but she suffered from a lack of screentime, and her backstory was largely buried in the archives.
Contrast this with Nier, which had a sarcastic talking book, a foul-mouthed hussy slaying monsters in her undergarments, and a grizzled protagonist ("I think you want a doctor.  I'm just a big guy who kills things.").
I usually play games with Japanese audio, but played Automata with English, hoping that there might be a reprisal of Kaine's glorious profanity.  But unfortunately, the dialogue (or localization?) wasn't quite at Nier's level--although A2 did have occasional moments.

Music:  ...yes.  Very.

Overall:  I officially endorse this product.  Although I've finished this game, I kinda want to go back and play it again.  Maybe I could erase my memory, and start fresh?  That always works out.


...but seriously, even if it was a joke ending, [L] was the one where I sat back, and said to myself: Yeah, I could go with that.

[L]one Wolf:
Spoiler: show
Fed up, 2B left the camp to its fate and decided to...go fishing?  Yeah, that's it!  Fishing!  With a smile on her face, she packed up and headed for the coast.
Ten years later, 2B would find herself hunted by both machine lifeforms and YoRHa assassins--a life she seemed to enjoy more than her previous one.

« Last Edit: March 27, 2017, 09:14:57 PM by ironmage »

Ramza

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Re: Nier 2 for PS4
« Reply #170 on: March 27, 2017, 09:38:27 PM »
2B never really strayed from the kuudere type

Thoughts about this and/or challenging this:

Spoiler: show

Remember that scene right after the first mission when 2B's left fist is down by her waist but you see her clench it? And we were all like "ok, there's emotion buried there, wtf is this?"

And then remember at the end of A/B paths, when 2B says "why does it ALWAYS have to end like this?" and then you're all "wtf is always?"

And THEEEEN remember at the end of C/D/E when A2 pulls out the truth on 9S? That 2B's true handle was "2E"? There's a side quest that explains what E-class YoRHa units do: they execute. They're assassins. The game keeps presenting it like 9S is getting paired with 2B to help her, when in fact (as 2B knows all along) she is getting paired with a 9S who keeps having the most recent bits of his memory erased so he never discovers the full truth, because he's THAT good and finding info and piecing things together.

2B breaks her mold, which ... forgive me, but I'm going to drop the Japanese-cliche language of "kuudere" and just go with "emotionless android" -- which is a fairly universal concept. Anyway, 2B breaks her mold. More than once. The end of A/B, and then from that point until her death, she is clearly 'alive' and 'self-actualized,' holding back nothing.


As for A2's backstory ...

Spoiler: show

more than the archives, her story is also buried in the Stage Play "YoRHa" -- which I've been trying to find w/ English subtitles but have failed to find so far. Most of the play is on YouTube, in segments. Of note, it's here you can determine for sure that the Commander, Jackass, Anemone, and A2 all knew each other as they were all part of the Pearl Harbor mission. They all had flower code-names back then. ("Anemone," alongside being a sea creature, is a flower name, so she didn't change hers.)

ironmage

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Re: Nier 2 for PS4
« Reply #171 on: March 28, 2017, 12:58:53 AM »
2B never really strayed from the kuudere type

Thoughts about this and/or challenging this:

...quoting in context with spoiler tags is going to be interesting.  Apologies if I mess this up.
Spoiler: show

Quote
There's a side quest that explains what E-class YoRHa units do: they execute. They're assassins.
The sidequest with the red hood was classic science fiction writing.  I worry that too much of the good material in this game is missable.

Quote
2B breaks her mold, which ... forgive me, but I'm going to drop the Japanese-cliche language of "kuudere" and just go with "emotionless android" -- which is a fairly universal concept.
But those terms aren't equivalent.  A kuudere is not an emotionless android.  A kuudere outwardly appears cold, but occasionally has a faint show of emotion, sometimes with a significant breakthrough later in the story.  Literally, "kuu" -> "cool", "deredere" -> "lovestruck".

Terminology aside, perhaps I should simply have said that 2B did not surprise me as a character.  What happens to her is often surprising, and the sequence leading to her death at the beginning of route C is something I'm going to remember for a long while.   That was good video game directing.  But as for her as a person...well, if you took her outside of the plot of the game, who would she be?

To put my opinion in context, I finished Tales of Berseria a couple weeks ago, and the "protagonist", Velvet, is on the surface a kuudere.  But she surprised me at almost every turn.  She took the kuudere trope, embraced it, twisted it, strangled it, crushed it underfoot.

Had I played Automata before Berseria, I probably would have been more forgiving of the characterization in Automata (and less accepting of the graphical quality in Berseria).


Quote
As for A2's backstory ...

Spoiler: show

more than the archives, her story is also buried in the Stage Play "YoRHa" -- which I've been trying to find w/ English subtitles but have failed to find so far. Most of the play is on YouTube, in segments. Of note, it's here you can determine for sure that the Commander, Jackass, Anemone, and A2 all knew each other as they were all part of the Pearl Harbor mission. They all had flower code-names back then. ("Anemone," alongside being a sea creature, is a flower name, so she didn't change hers.)


Backstory presented outside of the game.  Mmph.  Well, if you do manage to find it in English, I'd appreciate a pointer.


Ramza

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Re: Nier 2 for PS4
« Reply #172 on: March 28, 2017, 04:37:06 AM »
Backstory presented outside of the game.  Mmph.  Well, if you do manage to find it in English, I'd appreciate a pointer.

Yeah. Yoko Taro does that, maybe too much. In this case though, the YoRHa stage play was released *years* before Automata's release. So for Japanese fans, they've had time. :)

Which is why I hope the thing gets subtitled, ASAP.

As for your insights on 2B, thank you. I think I know where you're coming from and ... yes, compared to the original NieR, that might be one of the weaknesses of Automata. Kainé alone was probably one of the most interesting characters in NieR, and there is no single character that lives up to that kind of narrative ... especially when you start Route B in NieR! :)

Spoiler: show
BUT ... short as their subplot may have been, the last pair of twin red-haired androids, Devola and Popola in Automata, might have been one of the greatest things ever. When they pull their swords and run at 9S and you're like "Jesus, not again" (if you played NieR) and then they keep running and take on machines so 9S can hack into the tower ... god I loved that scene.

bigdeath

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Re: Nier 2 for PS4
« Reply #173 on: March 28, 2017, 11:05:05 AM »
The play translation is here: http://nier2.com/yorha-stage-play/

eightbitsamurai

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Re: Nier 2 for PS4
« Reply #174 on: March 28, 2017, 01:41:11 PM »
Soundtrack is here early

Good Tuesday

Ramza

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Re: Nier 2 for PS4
« Reply #175 on: March 28, 2017, 02:14:16 PM »
Soundtrack is here early

Good Tuesday

wuuuuuut? I did CDJ's most expensive shipping option, mine isn't here yet! *pouty face*

Kevadu

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Re: Nier 2 for PS4
« Reply #176 on: March 28, 2017, 02:43:39 PM »
Queue rant about lack of a digital version.

ironmage

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Re: Nier 2 for PS4
« Reply #177 on: March 28, 2017, 06:32:59 PM »
Kainé alone was probably one of the most interesting characters in NieR, and there is no single character that lives up to that kind of narrative ... especially when you start Route B in NieR! :)
I quite agree.  When Mickeymac was dismissive of starting a second playthrough of Nier, it was all I could do not to scream "just the first fifteen minutes!  JUST THE FIRST FIFTEEN MINUTES!"

But I expect that would have been counterproductive.

bigdeath

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Re: Nier 2 for PS4
« Reply #178 on: March 28, 2017, 07:28:33 PM »
The title does not appear in game until part B starts. The whole first playthrough is like a super extended prologue. The real meat of the story doesn't appear until part C.

This is a very odd ball game that messes with so many gameplay conventions.
« Last Edit: March 29, 2017, 11:16:54 AM by bigdeath »

Ramza

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Re: Nier 2 for PS4
« Reply #179 on: March 28, 2017, 10:48:53 PM »
The title does appear in game until part B starts. The whole first playthrough is like a super extended prologue. The real meat of the story doesn't appear until part C.

This is a very odd ball game that messes with so many gameplay conventions.

Exactly. THere aren't devs out there like Yoko Taro (so far as I know), which means there aren't games out there that break expectations in the way Automata (and NieR 1) have done.
Spoiler: show

There's the little stuff, like camera changes from over-the-shoulder to free-form (Kingdom Hearts-ish) to aerial to side-scroller. There's 9S' ability to hack into enemies and control them (most of the hard-to-find lore requires doing this, because the machine he's hacked can then hack *by proxy* on a treasure chest). And then there's the big stuff, like characters' true identities, the "real mission" of YoRHa, and the incredible value of the Pods.

(They got sold short INTENTIONALLY for most of the game -- they seem to be *nothing* compared to Grimoire Weiss. But in the end ... something has happened. Something that is, apparently, inevitable. Life is life. I want to throw in some Jeff Goldblum Jurassic Park Chaos Theory: "nature (machine nature?) found a way.")
« Last Edit: March 29, 2017, 10:51:22 PM by Ramza »