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Author Topic: i give up.  (Read 9801 times)
Akanbe-
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« Reply #15 on: March 19, 2007, 12:28:08 PM »

Quote from: "Alisha"
i can deal with needing to spend points to get access to new weapons,armor and magic/skills but accessories? come on now. another problem with this game is it indirectly punishes you for not exlporing or doing sidequests. if you just go from point A to point B without at least exploring you will find yourself quickly underleveled. i tried to force myself through it for the story but i couldnt do it anymore. when i was stopped i just died at some zombie dragon at a lighthouse.


I always felt license points were quite abundant.  

Zombie dragon?  i thought he was easy, but it depends on how many sidequests you have done because at that point your gear and spell arsenal can be vastly different if you have done them (and I have).

Honestly there is a FF12 "ez moad" if people want to use it.  While fighting pretty much anything except a hunt or boss, have your party equipped with Embroidered Tippets which double the xp you gain.  This makes skipping areas very possible.  I found it pretty easy to power level your way up in a rather small amount of time with those accessories on.  Also between the three quickening charges on your main characters to triple their MP, I had one of my characters equip a Nihopalaoa and had them pick up all the remedy lores on the license board.  This made some fights a hell of a lot easier because a single remedy could inflict every status ailment on an enemy as long as they aren't immune to that particular ailment.

Quote from: "Dincrest"
I'm probably one of the few who really likes FF12's music. Sure the music does not stand up well on its own and I wouldn't buy the soundtrack, but within the context of the game, it's great. It adds the right amount of atmosphere without overpowering anything, like too much salt on french fries. Again, I could spend all day in Rabanastre, because not only is it an awesome town visually, but that town's theme is killer.


I wouldn't say I really liked the music, but I thought it was pretty good as well.  I enjoyed listening to most tracks and nothing really bothered me.  The music felt like it fit.

I'm in the second to last dungeon and the only thing I can say I am disappointed with is the story.  I heard it picks up towards the ending so I'm hoping for that.  It just feels like (not really a spoiler but ill put it in a code just in case)
Code:
the world is left unexplored.  Rozarria?  We talked to one dude with a European accent from there.  We didn't even step foot in the place.  Very disappointing.

I also feel that too little has happened in the game's span.  The game is almost over yet I don't feel it should be.
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"Karma is...secret top tier"~Starmongoose
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Bernhardt
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« Reply #16 on: March 19, 2007, 02:14:51 PM »

I'm waiting for FFXII to go down in price. I don't like how people are telling me they're spending 100+ hours playing the game, when they're telling me they're mostly just exploring and level-building. Sounds like any previous FF as of late; takes (an) hour(s) before you get just from point A to point B, because your characters move so slowly.

Remember Final Fantasy VIII? I got Diablos, and learned "No Encounters" as soon as "Magic Lamp" was first available. And somehow, I still managed to log 60 hours into the game.

I'm definitely going to Gameshark this one. I've said it before, and I'll say it again: level-building does not constitute gameplay. If I have to run around aimless in circles just to get encounters and experience to defeat the next boss, that's a problem of either dungeons being too short, or enemies not supplying enough experience or money. Once I reach the end of a dungeon, I should be able to defeat the boss.

RPGs need to figure out how to rely more on strategy than numbers.
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Akanbe-
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« Reply #17 on: March 19, 2007, 02:31:53 PM »

Quote from: "Bernhardt"
I'm definitely going to Gameshark this one. I've said it before, and I'll say it again: level-building does not constitute gameplay.


I never felt I had to level build at all until one of the last few dungeons.  I didn't fight any more enemies than I had to to finish the dungeon.

Like I said earlier, if it concerns anyone, you can buy Embroidered Tippets somewhere around mid-game to compensate if you're feeling "low leveled".
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« Reply #18 on: March 19, 2007, 02:42:10 PM »

I think most of the people you see talking about spending hours level building is because they enjoy the combat, not because they need to level.  I beat it in 50 hours just fine without a single levelling session.
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daschrier
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« Reply #19 on: March 19, 2007, 05:57:58 PM »

I've played every final fantasy, and only 4,10, and 12 have managed to keep my attention. I spent 100 hours on 12, which is the most time I've ever spent on any game, next in line being dq8 around 80 hours. The story is nothing special, but the game is damn fun.

A solid game in my book.
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Dincrest
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« Reply #20 on: March 19, 2007, 07:17:12 PM »

Akanbe, if you felt the way you did in your coded spoiler thingie, that's part of the reason for FFXII- Revenant Wings.  It's purpose is to flesh out Vaan and Penelo (two largely neglected characters), and likely flesh out the neglected parts of the world, such as the Sky Continents (which I have no idea how much they figured into FFXII.)  

Anyway, FFXII is kinda like a radish.  It's a food with a strong flavor and thus an acquired taste.  Some people love it right away, some people learn to love it, and others can never like it no matter how much they try to.
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Alisha
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« Reply #21 on: March 20, 2007, 12:05:12 AM »

Quote from: "GrimReality"
Wow, such hostility. I didn't realize so many folks had such issues with the game.
The nice thing, i've found, about this game, is that you can choose not to do things that you don't like or are confused by.
I have obtained only two summons in the course of the game so far(I have played for over 60 hours and am in the Salikawood) I think I used the fire dude once.
I have used quickenings only a few times.
I rarely, if ever, use teleport stones to go anywhere. This results in my characters leveling up fairly well, and obtaining enough loot to sell for Gil. I have no complaints here.
The only time I have used teleport stones is when doing hunts, which I find fun, and a good way to build up your characters inbetween following the story.
I am NOT playing the game for the story. I honestly have no clue what is going in the story, and don't really care. I DO like the characters, and want to know what is going to happen to them.
The license board is kinda stupid, but it is a minor complaint surrounded by a lot of good.
I actually like the gambit system quite a bit. I also rather enjoy the battle system. After this game I will be dreadfully bored with any game heralding a "traditional" rpg setup.
I agree with DC about the music. While I would not listen to it outside of the game, it fits very well within the context of the game itself.
I know Alisha enjoys her online gaming, but I don't understand why she is comparing those games to an offline game.
Personally, I have yet tp play an online rpg, and hope to keep it that way.


the reason i compared ffxii to ffxi is because it seemingly uses the same engine yet manages to completly destroy things that ffxi did well or at least better than ffxii. even though one game is offline and one game is online a lot of stuff felt like a step backwards.

mist knack chains = weapon skills + skillchains except in ffxi they cost a tp bar instead of your mp bar.

im also a staunch hater of god characters syndrome. say what you want in this game 1 character alone cannot keep the party healed and alive.

3 character battles are stupid and archaic. also i think think this is the first rpg ive played in a long time where characters not in the active party DO NOT recieve any exp.
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Eusis
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« Reply #22 on: March 20, 2007, 12:32:46 AM »

Quote from: "Alisha"
3 character battles are stupid and archaic.

Fully agreed with. I could excuse it due to polygons and whatnot in the 32-bit era, but nowadays games are perfectly capable of having 4 characters without loading, performance, or memory issues.
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ssoass
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« Reply #23 on: March 20, 2007, 04:33:08 AM »

But you do regularly get 4 characters in your party when a guest joins you.
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Hidoshi
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« Reply #24 on: March 20, 2007, 05:03:24 AM »

Why does the party number matter? By this logic, six person battles would be ahead of their time, and twelve person battles are just freakin' out of sight.
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demifiend
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« Reply #25 on: March 20, 2007, 05:32:22 AM »

Color me unimpressed with the game. I agree with the favor towards characters like Balthier and Fran, and the story is a nice change of pace from the others, but the gameplay elements feel almsot tacked on to a world that isn't even all that original. I mean, these guys developed FFXI, and all they really did was superimpose that game's battle and leveling system onto the story from Tactics. And this took 4 years to make? I would like to see their artists contribute to other Final Fantasy games, but keep the rest of the staff as far away as fucking possible. I'm sure Square could wave some cash in front of the faces of the designers at Level 5 or tri-Ace and get them to work on the next Final Fantasy. Take FFXII's team and turn them loose on the next Square MMO, probably another one that emulates the joys of prison sex.
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Eusis
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« Reply #26 on: March 20, 2007, 05:39:34 AM »

Quote from: "ssoass"
But you do regularly get 4 characters in your party when a guest joins you.

They tend to screw up my strategy, so I'd prefer to have 4 I have full control over, rather then 3 that I can control completely and 1 that just follows the AI's whims.

Party size isn't purely cosmetic, it can change the strategies required and give a bit more breathing room for how I would like to do things. In a three member party for example, in a game without hot swapping or the ability to use items on characters outside of my party (exempting FFXII, admittedly), I could have one member die. Depending on the balance, I would have to have one guy revive, and the other heal, and for some bosses in games this could result in several rounds doing nothing, just struggling to maintain the status quo. At least with 4 members I can have the last one either do additional healing so I'm not in a rut, or do damage to the boss and pick at it's HP while the other two worry about reviving the dead guy. Five or more is something I wanted years ago, but am mostly apathetic to now. Games like Suikoden or Chrono Cross need it more, just so I can make more use out of ridiculously large casts.
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Dincrest
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« Reply #27 on: March 20, 2007, 08:19:00 AM »

Alisha- you *do* realize that RPGs where people not in the active party do not receive experience is the norm rather than the exception, right?  It's a sucky norm, but a norm nonetheless.  

That's why I was so tickled pink when everyone in Tales of Symphonia received the same amount of EXP regardless of whether they fought or not.  Kept things smooth, especially during the times when Sheena or Colette had to be in the battle party; I almost never used them in regular battles but their levels were always perfect when I had to fight one of "their" battles.  

But Symphonia's the exception rather than the rule.  

On the other hand, games like, well, pretty much all FF games, Star Ocean 2, and most others just to name but two examples have the "no fight no EXP rule."

Games like Suikoden do well in that when taking a level 10 lowbie out with a bunch of level 40s, the lowbie would hit level 41 around the same time as the others.
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Sapphire_Fate
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« Reply #28 on: March 20, 2007, 12:38:25 PM »

Quote from: "demifiend"
Color me unimpressed with the game. I agree with the favor towards characters like Balthier and Fran, and the story is a nice change of pace from the others, but the gameplay elements feel almsot tacked on to a world that isn't even all that original. I mean, these guys developed FFXI, and all they really did was superimpose that game's battle and leveling system onto the story from Tactics. And this took 4 years to make? I would like to see their artists contribute to other Final Fantasy games, but keep the rest of the staff as far away as fucking possible. I'm sure Square could wave some cash in front of the faces of the designers at Level 5 or tri-Ace and get them to work on the next Final Fantasy. Take FFXII's team and turn them loose on the next Square MMO, probably another one that emulates the joys of prison sex.

I totally agree with you.
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Masamune
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« Reply #29 on: March 20, 2007, 04:17:01 PM »

Whether or not you enjoyed the game, the fact of the matter still is that FFXII was accepted by the majority as a great game.  As I've said myself, the storyline and character development is a bit lacking, but it's by no means horrible.  On top of that, the fun gameplay makes up for it.  I've heard a few people complain about how FFXII "plays itself", but I think that is a really flawed argument.  I don't think it's the best FF or even one of the top 3, but it's still one of the best RPGs to come out in all of 2k6.
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