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Author Topic: GameIndustry.biz writer rips into Manhunt 2  (Read 8476 times)
Lard
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« Reply #15 on: June 24, 2007, 04:38:52 PM »

It's been heading that way for the last year or so - Manhunt 2 certainly wasn't the cause of it.
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Eusis
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« Reply #16 on: June 24, 2007, 04:43:32 PM »

Most of it is because the ESRB is being considered incompetent and whatever. This is one of the only things they've done recently that appeases the politicians, and it's also a game that looks to be genuinely worth the AO.

If you ask me though, they should just allow the AO games to be published and sold in stores. Hide them under the counter and whatnot, then the stupid rating will actually be used and not simply a warning to tone stuff down. But then they probably need to do what was suggested for the movie industry and divide it into two ratings; One for obscene violence, one for pornography, since it's more or less the mentality of falling under the latter that gets all the stores riled up and refusing to sell it.
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Zebulun
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« Reply #17 on: June 24, 2007, 04:43:38 PM »

Quote from: "Lord Scottish"
Quote from: "Zebulun"
Good for them. As we all know, games are nothing more than murder simulators......

Anyway this doesn't bother me. Games like Manhunt really aren't my cup of tea. So if a game were to fall to the rating boards, this one might as well be our pariah.


"They came for the Jews, and I didn't protest because I wasn't a Jew..."

It's a slippery slope. We have to fight this.


That is completely different and you know it. It's a videogame. It was internally censored by the industry. We are NOT talking about the extermination of a people here. Jeez.

Rockstar is pushing the envelope just to push the envelope. Do you really think they're our last bastion of free speech? Hardly.
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Eusis
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« Reply #18 on: June 24, 2007, 04:45:15 PM »

R*'s claiming it's art, admittedly. I don't know whether that's just 'shut up first amendment bitches' or if there's any actual basis. I suppose if reviews come out we can know for sure.
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Dade
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« Reply #19 on: June 24, 2007, 05:36:31 PM »

Quote from: "Eusis"
R*'s claiming it's art, admittedly. I don't know whether that's just 'shut up first amendment bitches' or if there's any actual basis. I suppose if reviews come out we can know for sure.


That's like Eli Roth saying that his Hostel series is great because it's Artsy Fartsy.

Fuck Manhunt, Fuck Rockstar, and Fuck Eli Roth.

*Sorry...just watched the first Hostel at a friend's "request" saying it wasnt as bad as I had heard. I gutted him later.*
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« Reply #20 on: June 24, 2007, 05:44:06 PM »

Aww, it was so close.  I thought we might get ten posts into this topic without a Nazi reference, but number nine had to come along and remind us that we're on the internet.

I agree with SP fully.  Getting riled up over this worthless collection of sadism is foolish.  Defending this trash, which caters to the lowest common denominator of our chosen form of entertainment, is a lot like sending out a battalion of tanks to conquer an ant bed:  there are plenty of battles that are more worthy of our manpower and resources.

EDIT:  Fuck, Dade beat me to the Hostel reference.  I couldn't remember that fucking director's name. :P
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Eusis
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« Reply #21 on: June 24, 2007, 06:08:10 PM »

I don't really know much about Hostel or even want to see it, but these replies are more and more convincing me that the art claims are utter nonsense. :P
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everluck
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« Reply #22 on: June 24, 2007, 08:52:15 PM »

Quote from: "Lard"
Just because *you* don't like the idea does *not* make it okay to be banned.

I never said it did. I'm sure the sadists and BDSM advocates would love it.
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« Reply #23 on: June 24, 2007, 09:12:17 PM »

Quote
You can't go around saying "one kind of censorship is okay and another isn't."

Games are games.

Just because *you* don't like the idea does *not* make it okay to be banned.

It should bother you, because the last thing we need is fuckers like Jack Thompson getting a foothold in the ESRB


Y'know, yes I think I can. Because I firmly believe some things ought to be censored. You don't cry fire in a crowded theater when there's no fire, you don't allow child pornography, and frankly, I wouldn't be sad if a game thats SOLE PURPOSE is to cater to people with a violence fetish is banned off the shelves.

Honestly, the point still stands that America isn't even banning the game, which speaks to the health of our First Amendment. Britain doesn't have our laws, we have no say in their government (well, aside from Deg and the other Brits), there's not much to complain about. The game's getting the rating it deserves as per the ESRB rating guidelines which is pretty much the only thing keeping the less fundamentalist groups from coming down harder on the industry.

Games like this give other games that would otherwise have some legitimate form of artistic expression a strike against them already, making it even HARDER for those games to get approval from those who vote on these matters. Jack Thompson is currently a big joke even amongst the people he once was a demagogue to, let's keep it that way by showing the non-gaming world that gamers don't immediately run to a game just because of the violence and XTREEMness of it.
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Lard
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« Reply #24 on: June 24, 2007, 11:31:29 PM »

It makes me sad to see that this forum is pro censorship. I thought you were video game fans.
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Ashton
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« Reply #25 on: June 24, 2007, 11:54:28 PM »

Idiotic one liners lend your stance less credibility, not more.
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Lard
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« Reply #26 on: June 25, 2007, 12:07:32 AM »

How else can you respond to something as idiotic as being pro censorship?
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Eusis
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« Reply #27 on: June 25, 2007, 12:25:42 AM »

You're just brainlessly thinking 'CENSORSHIP BAD CENSORSHIP BAD' without considering that extreme attitude could really just force the government to impose real censorship. Look at my exercise analogy, if the game industry just throws around a bunch of games that go to the absolute extreme possible, then it'll blow up in everyone's faces and there may be real laws that force censorship. And if it's not that, then it could be retailers dropping to T rated games to cover their ass or whatever.

No, I don't want games like Manhunt 2 to NEVER be accessible. If people want their ultra violent pleasures, fine, better a video game than real life anyway. But is it a good time to release this game, at least to an M rating? No, not really. Even if nothing bad happens from it, could there be some real good by sacrificing it so that we can more quickly have edgier games without a public backlash, hopefully edgier games with more of an actual purpose? I'd say yes.

... Better devolving to one line posts than some of the crap I've seen anyway.
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« Reply #28 on: June 25, 2007, 01:18:02 AM »

Quote from: "Lard"
How else can you respond to something as idiotic as being pro censorship?

Except you're trying to argue against intelligent, well thought out responses with retarded third grader comments, which just makes you look mentally deficit.
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Lard
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« Reply #29 on: June 25, 2007, 08:30:39 AM »

I tried making a valid argument and got responses like

"Games like Manhunt really aren't my cup of tea. So if a game were to fall to the rating boards, this one might as well be our pariah."

"Games like this give other games that would otherwise have some legitimate form of artistic expression a strike against them already, making it even HARDER for those games to get approval from those who vote on these matters. "


which are ignorant and hypocritical. And certainly not intelligent or well thought out.

And of course, there's the old minefield of one person what's art and what's not. Apparantly Sensei is allowed to dictate to everyone what games are artistic expressions and which ones aren't.

Quote from: "Eusis"
You're just brainlessly thinking 'CENSORSHIP BAD CENSORSHIP BAD' without considering that extreme attitude could really just force the government to impose real censorship. Look at my exercise analogy, if the game industry just throws around a bunch of games that go to the absolute extreme possible, then it'll blow up in everyone's faces and there may be real laws that force censorship. And if it's not that, then it could be retailers dropping to T rated games to cover their ass or whatever.


The problem with nutjob religious zealots and assclown crusaders like Jack Thompson is that if you give them an inch, they'll take a mile.

If they score one victory, it's not going to make them back off. It's going to make them confident - scrutinising every single game out there for things that they don't like.

Better to give them no victory at all.
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