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Subject: 999 (Nintendo DS)
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Author Topic: Stupid RPG conventions/cliches you can't get past.  (Read 21775 times)
Blace
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« Reply #15 on: July 08, 2008, 12:27:34 AM »

Quote from: "Hidoshi"
Money probs in FFXII? Really? o_O

Anyhow...

I'm largely fine with clichés. Even stupid status effects and whatnot. Endbosses that don't make sense. What does bother me more and more however, is the lack of routines for NPCs. I'm one of those people who believes that when you make a gameworld with large cities and NPCs, you have to make me believe I am actually in a crowd, talking to people who have daily lives outside of my interactions with them.

Some games like Zelda: OOT and Shen Mue handled this quite well (though... pop up in Shen Mue was annoying), others like Lost Odyssey need a kick in the ass. I love LO, don't get me wrong, but the lack of NPC scheduling seemed weird given the high level of detail otherwise exacted.

Static NPC's are so 1998.


I think what you meant was: Lost Odyssey is so 1998. :P
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Hidoshi
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« Reply #16 on: July 08, 2008, 02:21:58 AM »

No, I mean the lack of scheduling in NPCs is 1998. I find the game otherwise a fairly good piece of work, with some wonderful characters and scripting. The dream sequences are especially nice.
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Akira
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« Reply #17 on: July 08, 2008, 02:25:52 AM »

You know what else I'd like to see? JRPGs getting more creative with magic. Why is it that every other game has the same Fire1, Fire2, Fire 3 BS? Can't the dude just learn to put more MP into the spell? I know there are a lot of exceptions and some games are better about this than others, but really, the same two dozen spells are in every game it seems.

Magic is an easy medium to innovate with. Why don’t they make wizards create giant magical hands to choke motherfuckers like DMC 4, or release swarms of hornets, or make people’s heads explode, or turn into dragons and eat children, or summon zombies, or control the enemy's mind and make him think he's John Malkovich, or turn into liquid metal and stab bitches like Terminator 2 (imagine if Vivi in FF9 could do that), or…or…I mean, shit, there are so many sweet ideas out there, fucking experiment for Christ’s sake.
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« Reply #18 on: July 08, 2008, 02:32:40 AM »

Quote from: "Hidoshi"
No, I mean the lack of scheduling in NPCs is 1998. I find the game otherwise a fairly good piece of work, with some wonderful characters and scripting. The dream sequences are especially nice.

That IS part of it's charm though. Not the NPCs, the way the game is like an RPG from 5-10 years ago but with modern graphics.
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daschrier
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« Reply #19 on: July 08, 2008, 07:54:26 AM »

My biggest gripe is missable stuff. I don't mind games that have ridiculously hard things to find as long as they aren't 1 time chances.

Square loves to do this shit, Zodia Spear anyone?

I don't know who loves to play RPG's several times to complete them, but it's not me.
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calintz
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« Reply #20 on: July 08, 2008, 08:00:09 AM »

jrpgs with no new game+
i hate that

i really don't want to level up again just to go thru the story... new game+ lets me smash thru another game just for story/nostalgia sake
like, i want to replay FF9 again, but the thought of having to level up, collect this and that, just to reminisce on the characters and dialogue is too much for me...

i don't have alot of time these days, and spending another 30 hours on the same rpg is annoying...
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DPB
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« Reply #21 on: July 08, 2008, 09:35:56 AM »

My biggest annoyance is games with multiple endings in which the normal ending is substandard, and you have to go to ridiculous lengths just to get a satisfying conclusion. Chrono Cross, Valkyrie Profile and FFX-2 spring to mind. I shouldn't have to consult a walkthrough to see something more than a few lines of dialogue then fade to credits.
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Kstar
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« Reply #22 on: July 08, 2008, 10:00:50 AM »

I really can't stand when you have to face the same boss more than once in a game.  I always think I already beat you...why am I fighting you all over again?  Now if there is a good reason that's fine, but if not, I feel why not just add more and different bosses.
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« Reply #23 on: July 08, 2008, 10:38:16 AM »

Random encounters.  Anyone who knows me and has read my posts around here can probably sum up my verbalizations on this outdated practice verbatim.  

Another thing I'm not fond of is "communist" decisions where the game offers you a choice but will not continue unless you make the choice the game wants you to make.  Suikoden 1 was a major offender here.  

Oh, and if I have to play another sullen whiny teenage pretty-boy angst-bucket emo kid with spiky hair who takes himself way too seriously...
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« Reply #24 on: July 08, 2008, 11:16:39 AM »

Firstly, I agree with Mesh on the tiny cities thing. I can't stand small town areas in general, but I really hate towns where you can barely enter any of the buildings. Yeah, I know that in the real world you wouldn't be able to enter a random person's house without trouble, but that's the charm of RPGs. I love running around a new town and exploring every inch.

I've noticed that 2D RPGs were great for this, what with having somewhat large-sized, very explorable towns (Suikoden II and Tales of Destiny are key here), but after the jump to 3D, town size and general explorability just decreased. Suikoden III had pretty terrible sized towns, in my opinion, although you could argue that most of the areas you visited were supposed to be small settlements. What mostly irked me was that the towns felt very linear in the sense that you couldn't fuck off and explore much at all, and while there were a lot of doors, only a few actually opened.

Another offender is the Tales of Destiny PS2 remake. I love the game to death, but somehow in the transition between the PS1 and PS2 iteration, all the game's shops became outdoor stalls, and towns were definitely downsized.

My second gripe is ugly party members. That seems shallow, but I really don't want to have to look at a bunch of uggos while I'm saving the world. I know having 'tough n' rugged' characters is an RPG staple, and that's fine, but I can't stand unnecessarily ugly characters. This transfers to me not particularly enjoying having non-human characters in my party. Animals are usually fine (Shiro and Blanca are particularly badass animal party members in Suikoden II and Shadow Hearts II) but I don't like animal-people at all. Because of that, I get really turned off of games like Breath of Fire, where every other character has a dog head or is half zebra or something.
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Bernhardt
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« Reply #25 on: July 08, 2008, 01:59:26 PM »

Quote from: "Kstar17"
I really can't stand when you have to face the same boss more than once in a game.  I always think I already beat you...why am I fighting you all over again?  Now if there is a good reason that's fine, but if not, I feel why not just add more and different bosses.

Wild Arms 4 makes you fight THE SAME BOSS TWICE IN A ROW many times. For example, in Belial's warped space, you find her, fight her, then you need to leave, and you fight her again to leave, before she finally dies.

I think that's pretty excessive myself, especially when they don't change things up the second time around.
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Angelo
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« Reply #26 on: July 08, 2008, 02:01:07 PM »

Quote from: "Dincrest"
Oh, and if I have to play another sullen whiny teenage pretty-boy angst-bucket emo kid with spiky hair who takes himself way too seriously...


Amen.  That's why characters like Ryudo in Grandia II stand out so much.  It's sad that meeting a character who isn't lame is surprising.  I think one reason why Link is so great in Twilight Princess, is because he doesn't say anything. :P  (Disclosure: I renamed him as Linkin, cause it's amusing.)

My list:

    [*] The load-bearing boss:  Seriously, can't I just nuke the fucker from orbit if the dungeon is going to collapse around him?

    [*] The unbeatable boss: Holy scripted battle, Batman!

    [*] Useless fetch quests.  The old lady is just deathly afraid of spiders, so you need to steal a broom from some dude who jealously guards them, but is distracted easily by the squeaky sound of brand new shoes, then the old lady might lead you into her basement to bestow the map for the magic something something that's buried halfway across the globe (the thing you already found, but had to leave behind because the plot isn't ready for you yet), except now she sees a rat in the basement, and she is deathly afraid of rats....
    [/list]
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    Ashton
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    « Reply #27 on: July 08, 2008, 02:26:40 PM »

    I fucking hate it when female characters get captured and then I'm forced to rescue them. Just let them fucking die.
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    Dincrest
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    « Reply #28 on: July 08, 2008, 03:01:15 PM »

    Quote from: "Leyviur"
    I fucking hate it when female characters get captured and then I'm forced to rescue them. Just let them fucking die.


    The real kicker behind that is that the female character is pretty badassed with magic spells, possibly knives, but once her "Achilles Heel" of a forearm is grabbed, she becomes a helpless and defenseless damsel in distress.  

    While Dark Master was making his little speech while holding Sodina's forearm, why couldn't Sodina have oh, I don't know, jabbed her knife into his thigh, twisted it, escaped his grasp, then have the party kick his ass for good?  (Thousand Arms.)

    As for fetch quests, I can't stand them in RPGs, but love them in graphic adventures.  Go figure.
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    Ashton
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    « Reply #29 on: July 08, 2008, 03:03:23 PM »

    Play Magna Carta.

    That game has made me intolerant to any damsel in distress girls.
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