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Author Topic: Street Fighter IV: 360 vs. PS3  (Read 18700 times)
Hidoshi
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« Reply #15 on: January 15, 2009, 07:04:34 PM »

For fighters, both suck. The PS2/PS3's configuration is atrocious for 2D fighting platforms. Be a man and shell out for a proper stick or Saturn-style controller.

If by Saturn-style you mean one of those controllers with 6 face buttons, those are horrific for 6-button fighters.  I bought one for the PS2 and it was nothing but clunky and awful.  R1 and R2 are much easier to use.

I already have a stick for PS2 and XBox, but it won't connect to my 360 so fuck it.

Soul Calibur IV does not count, because a) It's a game that takes no skill, and b) It's 3D, not 2D in gameplay. It doesn't even approach using SF-style mechanics, so rule that shit RIGHT out. Do not fuck around with me sir, I am hardcore about fighters.

The Saturn is the completely most awesome system for fighters ever. The DC would be, if it had a standard 6-button face controller. In terms of reaction, the face buttons are far better for 2D fighters than triggers or bumpers, especially when you either framecount, OR when you have high-end combos going.
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Blace
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« Reply #16 on: January 15, 2009, 07:18:02 PM »

For fighters, both suck. The PS2/PS3's configuration is atrocious for 2D fighting platforms. Be a man and shell out for a proper stick or Saturn-style controller.

If by Saturn-style you mean one of those controllers with 6 face buttons, those are horrific for 6-button fighters.  I bought one for the PS2 and it was nothing but clunky and awful.  R1 and R2 are much easier to use.

I already have a stick for PS2 and XBox, but it won't connect to my 360 so fuck it.

Soul Calibur IV does not count, because a) It's a game that takes no skill, and b) It's 3D, not 2D in gameplay. It doesn't even approach using SF-style mechanics, so rule that shit RIGHT out. Do not fuck around with me sir, I am hardcore about fighters.

The Saturn is the completely most awesome system for fighters ever. The DC would be, if it had a standard 6-button face controller. In terms of reaction, the face buttons are far better for 2D fighters than triggers or bumpers, especially when you either framecount, OR when you have high-end combos going.

I agree about the 2D and 3D thing, but you are wrong about skill. I know alot of people who actually know how to play that game, and they whip me at it everytime.
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Gen Eric Gui
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« Reply #17 on: January 15, 2009, 07:30:02 PM »

For fighters, both suck. The PS2/PS3's configuration is atrocious for 2D fighting platforms. Be a man and shell out for a proper stick or Saturn-style controller.

If by Saturn-style you mean one of those controllers with 6 face buttons, those are horrific for 6-button fighters.  I bought one for the PS2 and it was nothing but clunky and awful.  R1 and R2 are much easier to use.

I already have a stick for PS2 and XBox, but it won't connect to my 360 so fuck it.

Soul Calibur IV does not count, because a) It's a game that takes no skill, and b) It's 3D, not 2D in gameplay. It doesn't even approach using SF-style mechanics, so rule that shit RIGHT out. Do not fuck around with me sir, I am hardcore about fighters.

The Saturn is the completely most awesome system for fighters ever. The DC would be, if it had a standard 6-button face controller. In terms of reaction, the face buttons are far better for 2D fighters than triggers or bumpers, especially when you either framecount, OR when you have high-end combos going.

I, too, know my shit about fighters.  Real fighters, like Guilty Gear, SF3, Arcana Heart and KoF.  Shoulder triggers make everything easier, because man's thumb was not meant to traverse 6 buttons on top.
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Esper_Crusader
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« Reply #18 on: January 15, 2009, 07:34:30 PM »

I personally use the L/R(or triggers on 360 or DC) for the weak attacks. I use the bottom/left face buttons for medium, top/right face buttons for strong attacks. It might sound strange to some but i've always been comfortable with that setup.
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Hidoshi
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« Reply #19 on: January 15, 2009, 07:56:48 PM »

For fighters, both suck. The PS2/PS3's configuration is atrocious for 2D fighting platforms. Be a man and shell out for a proper stick or Saturn-style controller.

If by Saturn-style you mean one of those controllers with 6 face buttons, those are horrific for 6-button fighters.  I bought one for the PS2 and it was nothing but clunky and awful.  R1 and R2 are much easier to use.

I already have a stick for PS2 and XBox, but it won't connect to my 360 so fuck it.

Soul Calibur IV does not count, because a) It's a game that takes no skill, and b) It's 3D, not 2D in gameplay. It doesn't even approach using SF-style mechanics, so rule that shit RIGHT out. Do not fuck around with me sir, I am hardcore about fighters.

The Saturn is the completely most awesome system for fighters ever. The DC would be, if it had a standard 6-button face controller. In terms of reaction, the face buttons are far better for 2D fighters than triggers or bumpers, especially when you either framecount, OR when you have high-end combos going.

I agree about the 2D and 3D thing, but you are wrong about skill. I know alot of people who actually know how to play that game, and they whip me at it everytime.

Sir, I have beaten seasoned pro's of that game by button mashing. I have seen little girls be able to pick up that game and own in it. The game takes the smallest amount of skill to actually play. Yes, there are skilled players, but they do not rank high in the world of fighters. Virtua Fighter 5? There's a game that takes skill in the 3D realm. Soul Calibur IV is weaksauce.

As to the trigger buttons, you can't framecount with 'em, and high-ended combos like the ones needed in tournament fighting are not gonna fire properly without severe strain on your hands. But hey, if it makes you happy, so be it. Fact is, there are pads and sticks made for this livelihood for a reason: They're better.
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« Reply #20 on: January 15, 2009, 08:39:27 PM »

For fighters, both suck. The PS2/PS3's configuration is atrocious for 2D fighting platforms. Be a man and shell out for a proper stick or Saturn-style controller.

If by Saturn-style you mean one of those controllers with 6 face buttons, those are horrific for 6-button fighters.  I bought one for the PS2 and it was nothing but clunky and awful.  R1 and R2 are much easier to use.

I already have a stick for PS2 and XBox, but it won't connect to my 360 so fuck it.

Soul Calibur IV does not count, because a) It's a game that takes no skill, and b) It's 3D, not 2D in gameplay. It doesn't even approach using SF-style mechanics, so rule that shit RIGHT out. Do not fuck around with me sir, I am hardcore about fighters.

The Saturn is the completely most awesome system for fighters ever. The DC would be, if it had a standard 6-button face controller. In terms of reaction, the face buttons are far better for 2D fighters than triggers or bumpers, especially when you either framecount, OR when you have high-end combos going.

I agree about the 2D and 3D thing, but you are wrong about skill. I know alot of people who actually know how to play that game, and they whip me at it everytime.

Sir, I have beaten seasoned pro's of that game by button mashing. I have seen little girls be able to pick up that game and own in it. The game takes the smallest amount of skill to actually play. Yes, there are skilled players, but they do not rank high in the world of fighters. Virtua Fighter 5? There's a game that takes skill in the 3D realm. Soul Calibur IV is weaksauce.

As to the trigger buttons, you can't framecount with 'em, and high-ended combos like the ones needed in tournament fighting are not gonna fire properly without severe strain on your hands. But hey, if it makes you happy, so be it. Fact is, there are pads and sticks made for this livelihood for a reason: They're better.

Absolutely correct about Soul Calibur.  I don't get what the fuss is about the 360 controller.  Use the joystick?  It works pretty damn good and I'd rather use that over the PS2/3 pad (which is better than the 360 pad, I agree).  The joystick also doesn't rip up your thumb nearly as quickly as the d-pad does for ps2/3.

Hidoshi.  We should play each other in SF2 Turbo HD Remix sometime.  My real life fighting-game buddies have PS3's, so I have no one to play against other than the random people on Xbox live who 90% of the time pick Ken
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« Reply #21 on: January 15, 2009, 09:11:36 PM »

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As to the trigger buttons, you can't framecount with 'em, and high-ended combos like the ones needed in tournament fighting are not gonna fire properly without severe strain on your hands.

Strain?  I have to strain my hands to try hitting all the various buttons on the 6-face controllers.  With the standard ones, my hand fits very comfortably around the controller, the way it was meant to wrap around the controller.

And yes, you can very easily do frame-by-frame shit with the shoulder keys.  I do it all the time, or I wouldn't be able to play Dudley(Combing 6HK into Tornado Blow is a single-frame link, and I can do it on pad after a little warming up) or properly juggle with Axl Low, both of which I can do quite easily.

The special controllers are made because -some- people can play easier that way.  But it is not a definitive fact that they are better.  You can make that argument for Arcade sticks, since "that's the way the game was meant to be played" or whatever, but ultimately it just comes down to player preference and what a player feels comfortable doing with his/her hands.  I can do quite comfortably on pad anything a pro player does on a stick, and I am confident in this statement.
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ChevalierEagle
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« Reply #22 on: January 16, 2009, 02:07:15 AM »

Soul Calibur IV does not count, because a) It's a game that takes no skill

You could pretty much say the same thing about any fighting game ever made. Anybody can take a Ryu/Mitsurugi/Ky/Kyo Kusanagi character and make some moves by just pressing random buttons. Mastering the game/character? Now that's a different story.
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Hidoshi
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« Reply #23 on: January 16, 2009, 02:51:50 AM »

No sir, you can't. There are games made with a high capacity for assfuckery. Soul Calibur as a series does this. It is extremely easy to get into and master because of how user-friendly it is. The two characters that actually take some talent to use? Taki and Maxi. Taki because of her short range and rather deceptive power, and Maxi because he's especially difficult to control. The problem is, only Taki actually requires skill, in the very real sense of that term. Maxi is more of a test of how well you can corral the game's innately ridiculous chaining system.

Parrying for instance, despite being touted as a core skill to master, is notoriously easy to pull off in Soul Calibur. Its timing is especially forgiving, as is the timing on virtually all the moves. The issue is that making parrying such an easy-access skill destroys the high-end gameplay possibilities. In another game like Last Blade II or Street Fighter III: Third Strike, it's a fair bit more difficult to pull off parrying, and the former even makes it a button-press deal that exacts insane amounts of punish time on the receiver's end.

Further, Kyo Kusanagi requires a fairly light touch. I've yet to meet a single newbie who can just pick up a King of Fighters title and do decently well with anyone outside of Terry. Even then, several of Terry's longer strings are pretty complex, even in a simpler (though more fluid) setting like [/i]Garou: Mark of the Wolves[/i].

But even when you have your Ryu or your Terry characters, generally the roles are limited to one or two main characters. The problem with Soul Calibur is that these characters are the norm, making the whole experience rather shallow. Don't get me wrong, I enjoy these games. Soul Calibur is a highly polished game. It cannot, however, compete as a skills-based fighting game, because it isn't. Virtua Fighter and to a lesser extent, Tekken own that 3D arena, and have for years.
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ChevalierEagle
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« Reply #24 on: January 16, 2009, 12:06:23 PM »

Nope, the game is easy to get into but not easy to master, and i have yet to see any noob button-mash it's way into victory with someone like Voldo or Ivy. Usually they would just pick a character with a long range weapon (Kilik, Nightmare) and they will hardly ever do a parry, and if that happens it would be just by accident. Even with someone like Nightmare you can get defeated quite easily if you have no idea what you're doing.

I guess it depends of the competition level of the place you visit to play. In that sense, in my stinky local arcades there is never a Soul Calibur, but there are plenty of KOFs, with everyone picking Kyo, Iori, Clark, Ralf and Yashiro if he's available. Then again, i managed to play in arcades in Japan, and the competition level over there is just insane.
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Eusis
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« Reply #25 on: January 20, 2009, 01:19:32 AM »

In the end then, the 360 D-pad is actually the better choice. I know, it's a piece of shit, but it IS an actual D-pad and will correctly register a quarter-circle motion. The PS2/PS3 setups are individual buttons and don't respond nearly as well due to the less tactile input.

They aren't individual buttons, they only LOOK that way. The center of the D-Pad is under the casing whereas every other D-Pad has it above, press a direction on that and you'll see the others move as well, evidence of them being a single unit that I realized when I was 11. And I have no idea how you can pull off anything that well on the 360 pad, I can reliably pull Shoryukens on the Playstation pad but not the 360 one, and on both of the controllers we have the D-Pad is unresponsive, and not even in the same directions.

Ironically, that crappy D-Pad will be part of the reason I'll get it on the 360 eventually. I've wanted something like the FightPad for the 360 for games better played with the D-Pad, whereas the PS3 would do just fine without it.
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Geop
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« Reply #26 on: January 20, 2009, 10:15:03 PM »

PS3 . Definitely.
Ever since I played MvC2 and SvC2 on my cousin's xbox, I've been scared of that there D-pad.
And when (if) your thumb starts hurting from PS3's D-pad, you can always tape a Loonie or a quarter on top to help with the diagonals!  :P
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« Reply #27 on: January 21, 2009, 12:09:38 AM »

I'm looking forward to it. I've been thinking about this long and hard, and I've decided to go with the 360 version. It isn't for the reason people are giving, since I plan on investing in an arcade stick. It's because that's where a lot of people will be at, and the online set-up is better.
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Eusis
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« Reply #28 on: January 21, 2009, 01:11:52 AM »

I'm looking forward to it. I've been thinking about this long and hard, and I've decided to go with the 360 version. It isn't for the reason people are giving, since I plan on investing in an arcade stick. It's because that's where a lot of people will be at, and the online set-up is better.

This is my secondary reason, but if the game pad hadn't been coming out I'd have gotten it on the PS3 purely because of the controller.
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« Reply #29 on: January 21, 2009, 10:50:06 PM »

To be honest, I think Capcom would be doing the fighter genre a favor by including an arcade stick peripheral with Street Fighter IV, to give beginners a good start, since by and large, arcade sticks are better than game pads. It's a shame that arcade sticks have to be so expensive. I was listening to the Giant Bombcast last night, and they were discussing how it's a disservice to the fighter genre by not giving beginner players a helpful tutorial option. In most fighting games, sure, they will give you a list of special moves with their button combination, but as far as implementing when they should be used, so that they're effective, fighting games don't offer good tutorials for that.

I've heard Street Fighter IV has a very well-done beginner's tutorial, and it's supposed to be thorough and effective in teaching beginners how to play the game, so that you have a winning chance. I'm skeptical, but we'll see. Me, myself, I'm not good at fighting games, but I would love nothing more than to get better and be able to play with the intermediate players. (Never mind expert players)
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