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Subject: 999 (Nintendo DS)
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Author Topic: Megami Tensei Topic  (Read 340532 times)
badsanta
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« Reply #1110 on: October 22, 2010, 04:56:33 PM »

Alright then; it was bad. It was decent at first; passable characterization, intriguing premise; plot moved sort of slowly, but the character's own problems and dealings helped to somewhat fill this void. But as it went along, the plot went along slower and the slower, the characters proved to be more shallow and less interesting, and the social links only helped so much. Then at last, came the final events...

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Enter 'The Power of Freindship'. How did MC defeat Nix by just holding up that card? How did he fly up to the big eye? Why in the world would all the relationships he made via the Social Links create this card--which should only exist in gameplay and not the plot--which seemingly does everything?
Why--you know, if I went over all of the plotholes, I'd be here all day. The point is, just because someone learned 'The Meaning of Life' doesn't magically grant them to all of that bullcrap that the MC did in the finale,
and on that note, considering all that everyone else went through, you'd think this whole BS would apply to the other party members at least [i]somewhat[/i].
And that's just The Journey; if everyone's 'negative thoughts' or whatever that was, are responsible for creating shadows, [i]why in the world isn't the planet covered with shadows by now?[/i]
And why would Erebus breaking through the seal cause a time-skip? Because it could? Yeesh.

And on top of all that, the plot still ended up being pretty shallow, along with a fair deal of the characters being like the plot as well; shallow and uninteresting. The best one was Junpei, but even he wasn't as good as he could have been. The high point of Persona for me is still the P2 duology, though maybe 4 will prove to be decent enough when I get around to that.
« Last Edit: October 22, 2010, 05:03:10 PM by badsanta » Logged
Gen Eric Gui
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« Reply #1111 on: October 22, 2010, 05:26:34 PM »

The reason Minato is able to do those things is because of his power of Persona.  You're also not realizing that a lot of that battle was symbolic, and not literal.

It sounds like you don't like the story largely because you didn't even bother to pay attention to it.
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badsanta
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« Reply #1112 on: October 22, 2010, 05:40:23 PM »

The reason Minato is able to do those things is because of his power of Persona.  You're also not realizing that a lot of that battle was symbolic, and not literal.

It sounds like you don't like the story largely because you didn't even bother to pay attention to it.

Oh, I payed attention. And if it was supposed to be symbolic, then it doesn't show us what actually happened, huh?

And just because Minato has his power of Persona doesn't mean he can do those things unless there are specific reasons, which there weren't. See, I must have a different idea of symbolism, because I did not see a smidgen of symbolism.

And again, I do pay attention; I wouldn't like Persona 2 so much if I didn't pay so much attention to that game's plot, and if I didn't pay attention to P3's plot, and ignored all of the plotholes, maybe I'd enjoy it more. But that isn't the case, and even if that were so, there would still be more general problems, as I've already described.
« Last Edit: October 22, 2010, 06:36:50 PM by badsanta » Logged
Kevadu
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« Reply #1113 on: October 22, 2010, 06:15:06 PM »

I agree with badsanta, actually.  P3's plot has a lot of issues, and 'symbolism' does not excuse sloppy writing.  I thought P4's plot was much tighter, and overall I enjoyed that game a lot more.
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Mickeymac92
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« Reply #1114 on: October 24, 2010, 12:30:54 AM »

I love the MegaTen games. I was admittedly pretty put off by Persona 3 at first, but once I tried Persona 2 and especially Shin Megami Tensei 1 for the Super Famicom, I fell in love with them. So far, I've played SMT1, SMT2, Nocturne, Strange Journey, Persona 1-3, and Devil Survivor, and I've loved all of them, though I've never finished any of them. These games are long. I still need to get the Devil Summoner games, then I'm just gonna try to focus on finishing the ones I got.
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kyuusei
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« Reply #1115 on: October 24, 2010, 12:53:17 AM »

I love the MegaTen games. I was admittedly pretty put off by Persona 3 at first, but once I tried Persona 2 and especially Shin Megami Tensei 1 for the Super Famicom, I fell in love with them. So far, I've played SMT1, SMT2, Nocturne, Strange Journey, Persona 1-3, and Devil Survivor, and I've loved all of them, though I've never finished any of them. These games are long. I still need to get the Devil Summoner games, then I'm just gonna try to focus on finishing the ones I got.

Definitely finish at least Nocturne, Strange Journey and P2.

And I'll say the same thing I tell pretty much everyone else around here: Get Digital Devil Saga 1 & 2 if you can. They have Nocturne's battle engine, if that helps any, and a great story.
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Mickeymac92
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« Reply #1116 on: October 24, 2010, 12:59:55 AM »

I love the MegaTen games. I was admittedly pretty put off by Persona 3 at first, but once I tried Persona 2 and especially Shin Megami Tensei 1 for the Super Famicom, I fell in love with them. So far, I've played SMT1, SMT2, Nocturne, Strange Journey, Persona 1-3, and Devil Survivor, and I've loved all of them, though I've never finished any of them. These games are long. I still need to get the Devil Summoner games, then I'm just gonna try to focus on finishing the ones I got.

Definitely finish at least Nocturne, Strange Journey and P2.

And I'll say the same thing I tell pretty much everyone else around here: Get Digital Devil Saga 1 & 2 if you can. They have Nocturne's battle engine, if that helps any, and a great story.

Strange Journey and P2 I'll finish no problem. Nocturne's a different story, but that's because I played it after I played Strange Journey, so it's a rough transition to say the least. Digital Devil Saga, on the other hand, doesn't really interest me. The gameplay doesn't sound interesting, and they took out the Negotiations that I love so much. I'll still probably get them, they're by far the lowest on my wish list as far as SMT goes.
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« Reply #1117 on: October 24, 2010, 01:06:56 AM »

SJ to Nocturne is probably a weird transition. I went the other way around and it's still kind of weird.

I love demon negotiations. I thought I would miss them and fusion in DDS but I really didn't. There isn't really room for them story-wise because the main characters ARE demons, and the games are kind of short anyway. ie. there's not a lot of optional places (like how Nocturne has the labyrinth) or places you can really go back to. You do come across the usual SMT demons in battle though. Otherwise the gameplay's much the same.

I keep forgetting that I haven't beaten Devil Survivor...
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Cyril
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« Reply #1118 on: October 24, 2010, 03:35:33 AM »

I don't know, if I started with DDS I probably wouldn't have gotten interested in SMT.  I found the story to be ridiculous and Part 2 absolutely butchered the series for me with the plot twist that puts SO3 to shame. The battles weren't particularly interesting for me, either.

I'd recommend SMT2 to start with, personally. Maybe it's just because it's what I started with and I'm loving it over nostalgia, but I feel it's the strongest in the series.

I'd also stay far away from Raidou 1 and immediately skip to Raidou 2.  Raidou 2 does everything Raidou 1 does, but about three times better.  But be warned that the load times are quite bad.
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Mickeymac92
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« Reply #1119 on: October 24, 2010, 05:04:56 AM »

I don't know, if I started with DDS I probably wouldn't have gotten interested in SMT.  I found the story to be ridiculous and Part 2 absolutely butchered the series for me with the plot twist that puts SO3 to shame. The battles weren't particularly interesting for me, either.

I'd recommend SMT2 to start with, personally. Maybe it's just because it's what I started with and I'm loving it over nostalgia, but I feel it's the strongest in the series.

I'd also stay far away from Raidou 1 and immediately skip to Raidou 2.  Raidou 2 does everything Raidou 1 does, but about three times better.  But be warned that the load times are quite bad.

I like your thinking, man. I like it a lot.:) Skipping Raidoh 1 anyways, since it lacks demon negotiations. I'll youtube the first if I need to. And the story of DDS does sound very off-the-wall, not so sure I'd like it.

However, I think SMT2 might be a bit too odd to start with. I tried it at first, but was completely lost. The first game starts out in a more meaningful way, and I think the story in 2 is easier to follow (kinda, sorta) if you play the first game first.
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« Reply #1120 on: October 24, 2010, 01:16:28 PM »

Skip Raidou 1? I was going to anyway mainly because it's hard to find, but if Raidou 2 is that much better I won't feel so bad. :P

And the near-ending twist of DDS2 is the one thing I don't like. I liked everything else. Would it have turned me off SMT? I don't think so, but I did play a whole lot of them before DDS so it's hard to say.

If I enjoy SMT if... I'll most likely try SMT I and II.
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MeshGearFox
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« Reply #1121 on: October 24, 2010, 07:02:20 PM »

I never really had much of a problem with load times in Raidou 2. IIRC it was loading stuff somewhat constantly in the background so it'd occasionally get these weird little stutters but I don't recall, for instance, the 12 second battle load-in times like I got in Tales of the Abyss.
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« Reply #1122 on: October 24, 2010, 08:13:56 PM »

I never really had much of a problem with load times in Raidou 2. IIRC it was loading stuff somewhat constantly in the background so it'd occasionally get these weird little stutters but I don't recall, for instance, the 12 second battle load-in times like I got in Tales of the Abyss.

I experience really long load times before a battle. I'm not sure why, either. It doesn't help that I have to go through pre-battle options before the actual battle starts. That's really my only complaint. Otherwise, the game is fantastic.
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« Reply #1123 on: October 24, 2010, 09:09:15 PM »

If I enjoy SMT if... I'll most likely try SMT I and II.
They aren't really related though. Shin Megami Tensei: If... is like Persona 0. Since the canon main character Tamaki Uchida makes several appearances in Megami Ibunroku: Persona, Persona 2: Innocent Sin, and Persona 2 Eternal Punishment. It's stated flat out in Megami Ibunroku: Persona that she transferred from another High School presumably "Karukozaka High School" (the setting of Shin Megami Tensei: If... and doesn't want to talk about what happened there.
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« Reply #1124 on: October 24, 2010, 09:12:26 PM »

I'm not talking story wise. The gist I get is that they play similarly.
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