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Subject: 999 (Nintendo DS)
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Author Topic: Who here actually liked lost odyssey?  (Read 9219 times)
Parn
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« Reply #15 on: April 22, 2009, 05:27:05 PM »

In a game like Lost Odyssey where the narrative is supposed to be taken more seriously and the overall mood of the game is darker than most games in its genre, having a bunch of brats tag along when all these monsters are dangerous to the average person completely destroys the immersion.  This is why I quit the game shortly after Cooke and Mack became part of the group.  Even the way they were introduced was totally random and absolutely ludicrous, with a pair of random knights on horseback going all "GRRR WE'RE MEAN SOLDIERS JUST BEING DICKS BECAUSE WE CAN" and bullying the kids while the three adults stand back as this cutscene drags on, all so the dumb looking boy can stand in a stupid pose and yell really loud, making a knight in full platemail fall over.  Yeah, OK.  Then cue obligatory boss battle because there hasn't been one in over an hour.  This game sucks.

Karol in Tales of Vesperia, on the otherhand, didn't bother me.  He serves as goofy comic relief in a game that doesn't really take itself seriously, even in the style of its presentation.  I finished the game, and kept Karol in the party at all times as my status effect removing backup healer.  I don't have a problem with kids in games, I have a problem with kids in games that are completely out of place.
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Buddy
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« Reply #16 on: April 22, 2009, 05:36:24 PM »

Karol sounds just like Rocky from Rocky And Bullwinkle.
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Gen Eric Gui
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« Reply #17 on: April 22, 2009, 06:58:38 PM »

The whole point of that scene with Cooke and Mack isn't to be comedic, it's to show that the kids are spunky and capable of handling themselves.  They are the descendants of Kaim, after all, and it's suggested that the human descendants of the immortals aren't exactly normal.

And besides, the kids are both fucking MAGES.  It's not like they're represented as unusually strong or anything.  They both require lots of protection until late in the game, at which point they've been traveling with and fighting with the party for long enough to be truly capable warriors in and of themselves.  I fail to see where the problem is with this scenario.

And if you quit the game because of that scene, well, I'm sorry for your loss.
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AJR
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« Reply #18 on: April 22, 2009, 08:06:19 PM »

Nah, he didn't miss out on much.
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Gen Eric Gui
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« Reply #19 on: April 22, 2009, 08:08:57 PM »

At the very least he missed out on the Thousand Years of Dreams, which I would say is the best part of any RPG I've played on the 360, and I played an RPG where I had a Werewolf punch Hitler IN THE FACE.
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Parn
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« Reply #20 on: April 22, 2009, 08:17:12 PM »

The whole point of that scene with Cooke and Mack isn't to be comedic
Obviously.  I'm not sure if you're assuming that I thought it was supposed to be funny, that all kids should only serve the purpose of comic relief, or what.

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it's to show that the kids are spunky and capable of handling themselves.
Yes, and it's totally believable that a knight is going to fall over on his ass because some little kid shouted really loud.  Meanwhile, Kaim and gang are twiddling their thumbs during this whole scenario.  What a respectable crew.

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And besides, the kids are both fucking MAGES.  It's not like they're represented as unusually strong or anything.  They both require lots of protection until late in the game, at which point they've been traveling with and fighting with the party for long enough to be truly capable warriors in and of themselves.  I fail to see where the problem is with this scenario.
As I recall, Mack had the same combat strength as Seth for melee attacks.  A little boy being able to even remotely come close to an immortal in melee combat is pretty far fetched, but hey!

If the game had relied on the storytelling as per the Thousand Years of Powerpoint, I'd have kept on going.  But I just couldn't stomach the in-game content once the kids hopped onboard, so the game ceased to be worth playing to me.  I'm probably way too jaded for my own good.
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Robert Boyd
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« Reply #21 on: April 22, 2009, 09:00:42 PM »

I enjoyed the game, but not enough to finish it.  My main problem was with pacing: it felt like the kind of game that I needed to have a minimum of 2-3 hours a sitting to play and that just doesn't work well with my schedule these days.  I played 'til disk 4 and then ended up trading it into Goozex for 1000 pts.  One of these days, I'll probably rebuy the game from a bargain bin and see if installing it to the hard drive speeds things up any.
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Gen Eric Gui
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« Reply #22 on: April 22, 2009, 09:32:54 PM »

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Yes, and it's totally believable that a knight is going to fall over on his ass because some little kid shouted really loud.  Meanwhile, Kaim and gang are twiddling their thumbs during this whole scenario.  What a respectable crew.

ITT we don't understand gross overgestures.  It's a very common thing in JRPG, you'd think you would have caught that!

And it was pretty obvious that Kaim didn't step in because he could tell the kids could handle themselves.  They make it abundantly clear that Kaim is a very good judge of character and talent, and he knew the knights wouldn't beat Cooke or Mack.  It's like a master watching his pupil from the shadows; he's confident that his pupil can win, but he doesn't step in so that the pupil can stand on his own feet.  This is ALSO a common idea in games and movies.

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As I recall, Mack had the same combat strength as Seth for melee attacks.  A little boy being able to even remotely come close to an immortal in melee combat is pretty far fetched, but hey!

Uh, no, he doesn't.  It's not even close.  Mack has higher STR than the other wizards, but it's lower than every other fighter in the game(Except Tolten, lol, but his whole point is that he has shit stats but amazing gear which balances it out)


And again, you stopped playing because of -one- scene.  If I had stopped playing Yggdra Union because the characters acted stupid during the tutorial videos, I'd be one sad puppy right now.


Robert: The game runs much more smoothly when it's installed.
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Parn
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« Reply #23 on: April 22, 2009, 09:56:47 PM »

And it was pretty obvious that Kaim didn't step in because he could tell the kids could handle themselves.  They make it abundantly clear that Kaim is a very good judge of character and talent, and he knew the knights wouldn't beat Cooke or Mack.  It's like a master watching his pupil from the shadows; he's confident that his pupil can win, but he doesn't step in so that the pupil can stand on his own feet.  This is ALSO a common idea in games and movies.
So, two armed knights can't handle two little kids in close quarters, one of them a girl with limited magic and a boy with the ability to yell really loud.  Yeah, your explanation sure has me convinced.
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daschrier
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« Reply #24 on: April 22, 2009, 10:49:41 PM »

You're right, it's so unbelievable that a soldier would fall over from a kid screaming because everything else about RPG's is just so realistic :)
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Gen Eric Gui
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« Reply #25 on: April 22, 2009, 11:54:26 PM »

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So, two armed knights can't handle two little kids in close quarters, one of them a girl with limited magic and a boy with the ability to yell really loud.  Yeah, your explanation sure has me convinced.

When they're both wizards and both the abnormally powerful children of immortal bloodline?  It would make less sense if the kids COULDN'T beat them.

Also: What daschrier said.  JRPG's are so well known for being completely faithful to the laws of physics and the real world.
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Dice
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« Reply #26 on: April 23, 2009, 12:13:42 AM »

At the very least he missed out on the Thousand Years of Dreams, which I would say is the best part of any RPG I've played on the 360, and I played an RPG where I had a Werewolf punch Hitler IN THE FACE.

Damn, you got to it before I did.

The game is a swell serve up to nostalgia.  Old-school game mechanics and all.  But the writing is definitely there.  I found the mini-stories in the 1000 Years of Dreams far more interesting than that of the main story.

In regards to Vesperia; I ended up liking him more than I thought I would.  He's cute, a bit naive, but terribly smart.  In fact, a bit too smart for a boy his age.  It was somewhat unrealistic, but better than a bratty dumb fucken character I suppose.
Ah well..."die eggbear!"
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Ashton
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« Reply #27 on: April 23, 2009, 12:17:19 AM »

Mack wasn't a wizard until he got possessed, which was well after that scene.

Plus, even if he had gotten through that one scene, there are plenty of others that were just as bad. It's not one scene. It's every scene the kids are in, because they are fucking insufferable. Your only defense is that JRPGs aren't supposed to be realistic, but there's a line between realism and seriousness. A game can be unrealistic but still serious in tone, and that scene fucks it all up. As mentioned before, if the game had the same tone as the Thousand Years of Dreams (which were absolutely stunning as far as narrative went), then the game would've been phenomenal. As it stands they attempted to make a JRPG that was serious and somber in tone, but ended up backpedaling to your usual JRPG cliches without remorse.

Also, kid characters can be used quite effectively. Karol in ToV had a gung ho attitude, and was just fun to watch. He didn't HIJACK A TRAIN TO SEE HIS DEAD MOTHER SOB SOB while his supposedly more level headed older sibling just went along with his dumbass plan "just because." Lymsleia in Suikoden V was a competent and capable princess and was so cute and cuddly you couldn't help but dote on and coddle her. She didn't sing a song her mother taught her to bring back her demented and batshit crazy grandmother.
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Dice
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« Reply #28 on: April 23, 2009, 12:26:17 AM »


Also, kid characters can be used quite effectively. Karol in ToV had a gung ho attitude, and was just fun to watch. He didn't HIJACK A TRAIN TO SEE HIS DEAD MOTHER SOB SOB while his supposedly more level headed older sibling just went along with his dumbass plan "just because." Lymsleia in Suikoden V was a competent and capable princess and was so cute and cuddly you couldn't help but dote on and coddle her. She didn't sing a song her mother taught her to bring back her demented and batshit crazy grandmother.

Love it. <3 Haha
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« Reply #29 on: April 23, 2009, 12:32:10 AM »

She didn't sing a song her mother taught her to bring back her demented and batshit crazy grandmother.

Ah hahahaha.

I mostly just lost interest because the 360 crapped out shortly after this arrived. I barely played it since, and wasn't exactly compelled to from what I'd seen.
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