The awful war between JRPGFans and WRPGFans

[ShadowLaguna]

what's going to be the next trend?

FPS vs TPS

[MeshGearFox]

I mean, when you put in great graphics and full voice acting, you lose so much. Oblivion's conversations were so barren compared to Morrowind.

Bethesda chronically mismanages their resources. Daggerfall took 5 years some how, and Oblivion was like "Hey let's spend all of our funding hiring Jean Luc Picard to do two lines!"

Morrowind's like the only RPG they've put together that they released in the expected time frame and without cutting everything. Unless you're a DF fanboy and like to maintain that they cut a bunch of stuff from the final product that was never in the game anyway, or something else insane.

Spoilers: Daggerfall only had like 20 hand-made areas in the entire game, and it doesn't matter HOW big your world is if there's nothing in it. This is a videogame. I want something interesting. If I want to go walk around somewhere barren and flat for hours on end without seeing anything I LIVE IN MOTHERFUCKING OHIO AND IT HURTS.

[Parn]

JRPGs beaten this console gen: Tales of Vesperia and Valkyria Chronicles
JRPGs sold back to Gamestop: Star Ocean 4, Lost Odyssey, Enchanted Arms, and The Last Remnant
JRPGs I'm looking forward to: Final Fantasy XIII

WRPGs beaten this console gen: Mass Effect, Fallout 3, Fable 2
WRPGs sold back to Gamestop: none
WRPGs I'm looking forward to: Mass Effect 2, Dragon Age, Alpha Protocol

That about sums up my perspective of the current console generation and the two sides of the genre.

[Sagacious-T]

I mean, when you put in great graphics and full voice acting, you lose so much. Oblivion's conversations were so barren compared to Morrowind.

Bethesda chronically mismanages their resources. Daggerfall took 5 years some how, and Oblivion was like "Hey let's spend all of our funding hiring Jean Luc Picard to do two lines!"

Morrowind's like the only RPG they've put together that they released in the expected time frame and without cutting everything. Unless you're a DF fanboy and like to maintain that they cut a bunch of stuff from the final product that was never in the game anyway, or something else insane.

Spoilers: Daggerfall only had like 20 hand-made areas in the entire game, and it doesn't matter HOW big your world is if there's nothing in it. This is a videogame. I want something interesting. If I want to go walk around somewhere barren and flat for hours on end without seeing anything I LIVE IN MOTHERFUCKING OHIO AND IT HURTS.

The thing is in Oblivion they put so much effort into making the world. Yet you got to a new town and all of a sudden had a couple quests to do. The main branches worked well but it felt like the world went to waste. They totally ruined the Dark Elves' voices too. Morrowind felt like such a complete game. Especially with the three very unique houses you could join and freedom of choice with everything.

It didn't help that the itemization and such of the game was a total disaster. Leveling was pointless. It's like they lost their focus along the way and made this horrible meshed together creature. Luckily you can download a gig or two of mods and fix that.

[Ramza]

I think the Roundtable Discussion some of the RPGFan staff engaged in back in 2007 is appropo for this thread. 

http://www.rpgfan.com/features/roundtable2007/index.html

I had nearly forgotten about that.

Time to have a roundtable 2009!

"Who's hotter? Neal or Sephiroth?"

[dalucifer0]

I personally think both have been lackluster this gen. I've played some of Fallout 3 and Oblivion, but I didn't get the hype like everyone else. Just not my cup of tea.

For JRPGs, Valkyria Chronicles is the only one that lived up to my expectations (though I haven't even come close to beating it.) ToV was disappointing to me, because the additions to the battle system were pretty lame in my opinion. SO4...just sucks, aside from the battle system.

So yeah, maybe once they start caring more about the core of the game instead of the aesthetics, then I'll start caring again.

[Akanbe-]

I personally think both have been lackluster this gen. I've played some of Fallout 3 and Oblivion, but I didn't get the hype like everyone else. Just not my cup of tea.

For JRPGs, Valkyria Chronicles is the only one that lived up to my expectations (though I haven't even come close to beating it.) ToV was disappointing to me, because the additions to the battle system were pretty lame in my opinion. SO4...just sucks, aside from the battle system.

So yeah, maybe once they start caring more about the core of the game instead of the aesthetics, then I'll start caring again.

Personally my favorite part of Tales of Vesperia is the fact that there are multiple, awesome (imo) costumes.  Too bad some of them come so late in the game.

I greatly prefer Jrpgs over Wrpgs.  I just enjoy Jrpgs more and there doesn't seem to be a Wrpg that can change that feeling.  However, it's obvious to me that so far, Wrpgs are superior than Jrpgs.  While I sorta like Fallout 3, Mass Effect, and Fable 2 (the most fun of the 3 imo), I do recognize them to be much better games as a whole.

[MeshGearFox]

The thing is in Oblivion they put so much effort into making the world. Yet you got to a new town and all of a sudden had a couple quests to do. The main branches worked well but it felt like the world went to waste. They totally ruined the Dark Elves' voices too. Morrowind felt like such a complete game. Especially with the three very unique houses you could join and freedom of choice with everything.

I loved Oblivion's combat. It was very weighty and kind of like the older King's Field games where every weapon *Felt* different. Morrowind's combat's just not that fun, and they really improved it, but... they didn't fix anything else. I mean, they promised you could get a pet dog, and make armor and weapons. That didn't happen. That's not even hard to implement. They implemented Radiant AI scripting and never actually did anything with it beyond really basic stuff. They never fixed the relative lack of interactivity with the world Morrowind had (in other words, you could pick up all the useless crap but you couldn't DO anything with it. Again, not really hard to fix).

The quest structure was also worse, I thought, since each guildhall only had like one or two quests, there were fewer quests in general, they weren't really any more in depth, and a lot of them were really similar (and not in a coyly winking "Do you see what we did there?" batch of Naked Nord quests like in Morrowind(.

But I agree MW had far better voice acting. Basically, in MW, Wood Elves sounded annoying because they're wood elves and they're supposed to sound annoying. In Oblivion, they sounded annoying because the voice actor wasn't great.

Also, my GOD have you ever played a more humorless game!

[Sagacious-T]

Oblivion's Combat was pretty solid, it hid the statistical side of combat from the casual player.

I still remember the BULLSHIT Radiant AI demo they showed off a long time ago, with the old school Dark Elf voices in it.

Here it is:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0RGoQk8pSlQ

I heard it was canned from the full release of the game.

Oblivion in my eyes was the best disappointment of a game I have played. It was just way under the scope that a hardcore RPG gamer wanted. They threw away a lot of the chance vs reward factors of the series  (Could you imagine facing the Telvanni guys unprepared in Morrowind?), and made it more accessible by making things easy. Like lockpicking, Persuading NPCs, and scaled enemies. All pointless. I guess I am the type of gamer who wants to progress through the world, get robbed a few times while I'm weak, then get stronger enough to overcome those enemies. Oblivion was just: "Welcome to the world, go beat shit to death now with this stick"

[MeshGearFox]

The funny thing is you CAN do that with Radiant AI. Bethesda is just incredibly inept.

[dalucifer0]

ToV is a good game, but coming after Tales of the Abyss, my favorite of the series, my expectations were too high. The Tales series basically back up why I like JRPGs: good characters and a great battle system. In ToV, it's sad when a fucking dog is better than most of the characters. And the villains had no character development while the villains had an abundance in TotA.

My biggest gripe about WRPGs is that I dislike the character designs. They're not appealing to me at all. I wanted to turn off the TV when I saw the old dude voiced by Picard.

[Sagacious-T]

I think Bioware makes pretty memorable characters. Each Mass Effect character had a very unique personality and design.

[Dizzy]

In ToV, it's sad when a fucking dog is better than most of the characters.

I dunno, I found Yuri pretty refreshing, in terms of main male leads. He knew exactly what he wanted, without creating any emo-inducing conflicts for himself.

Not to mention...

Code:

...he murders two people in cold blood without even giving it a second thought,
and without even regretting it for that matter.

[erwos]

A bunch of guys calling Bethesda lazy when they probably couldn't program their way out of a wet paper bag... classic.

Favorite RPG of this gen would be Fallout 3, closely followed by Mass Effect. That doesn't mean I didn't think Valkyria Chronicles and Disgaea 3 weren't absolutely amazing, though.

[Sagacious-T]

A bunch of guys calling Bethesda lazy when they probably couldn't program their way out of a wet paper bag... classic.

Favorite RPG of this gen would be Fallout 3, closely followed by Mass Effect. That doesn't mean I didn't think Valkyria Chronicles and Disgaea 3 weren't absolutely amazing, though.

I guess every food critic in the world must be a master chef, and every music enthusiast must be musicians themselves.