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Author Topic: Has anyone heard from Victor Ireland lately?  (Read 7988 times)
ronhelig
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« Reply #15 on: July 05, 2006, 05:20:59 PM »

I still wanna here Victor Ireland's big mouth again.  Like him or not, ya gotta admit he offers interesting perspective!  I didn't realize the Xbox had any non-western RPGs beyond a few remakes.  Fable "360" or whatever it will be called just doesn't get me all warm and mushy inside.
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Merkava
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« Reply #16 on: July 05, 2006, 07:54:07 PM »

Wow, so I'm STILL the only person her who likes WD's style. Ok, I've only played the Lunars, Alundra, and Growlanser Generations, but I love the fact that they actually have a style. There's actually some heart. So what if they take a lot of liberties with their translations, but do people really give a shit? I would rather have silly pop-culture references and the entertaining characters than a translation that stays faithful to the original and gives us something outdated.

Bah! Me and my love for companies that actually try during their localization processes...and ranting. Sorry. :P
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Eusis
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« Reply #17 on: July 05, 2006, 08:16:37 PM »

See, there's a difference between adapting a game to a different language, and what they typically did. If it was between those two, I'd stick with the literal, despite leaning more towards altering the dialogue. Preferably, I'd rather it stay in the center; taking liberties where necessary to retain the same intent in both languages (and cultures, if necessary), but not transforming characters into what they're not, and inserting ill fitting jokes where they don't belong.

Naturally, I can't comment on any translations compared to their original scripts, but I think games like DDS and SMT:N did a great job with having a flavorful script while not going over the top, and sticking well to their settings, and what I played of Vagrant Story again shortly ago has more standout dialogue than a lot of RPGs.

Really though, someone who works in translating/localizing, or at least is fluent in both english and japanese can comment better.

Edit: Oh, and mucking around with game balance is just fucking stupid unless 1. You know what you're doing, and/or 2. make it an additional difficulty, or at least give some way to access the original. WD never did either, and if anything screwed over the easier settings with limits on how far you can go and whatnot.
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Radien
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« Reply #18 on: July 06, 2006, 07:48:51 AM »

I didn't hate Victor Ireland, but I think his status is probably something that we don't really need to think about anymore. Whether you liked their translations or not, Working Designs used a questionable business model that probably wasn't to Vic's credit. That's what ultimately turned me off to them: the knowledge that if I didn't have the cash to fork over for one of their games right when it came out, I would probably have to pay a higher cost later on to find myself a copy. Vic came right out and proudly stated, once, that he intentionally kept supplies low in order make sure their games' resell prices stayed high.  It was a rather egotistical move that sacrificed sales AND cost consumers more money. How did this benefit us or the industry? I didn't like it.

This is what I must conclude when I think of Victor's quiet disappearance: he probably has a mid-level desk job at some company, making a decent living for himself, but without enough sway to have any major affects on the industry itself. He's got some interesting ideas, yes, but he's not the only one, and I'm sure many others have better business sense, so why cling so much to one particular person?...

Quote from: "Merkava"
Wow, so I'm STILL the only person her who likes WD's style. Ok, I've only played the Lunars, Alundra, and Growlanser Generations, but I love the fact that they actually have a style.

You're not. I liked them too. :) But I stopped worshipping their style as "best evar" after finally seeing some decent translations come out of other major sources -- Grandia 2, anyone?  There's a localization team that actually put forth the money to hire REAL professional voice actors with major experience in the field. I mean, holy crap: Leonardo and the Little Mermaid.

Incidentally, Alundra and Eternal Blue Complete had among the best translations I've seen to date. (discounting Kingdom Hearts, since the way it was created makes it almost unfair to compare it to other localizations)

Quote from: "Eusis"
Oh, and mucking around with game balance is just fucking stupid unless 1. You know what you're doing, and/or 2. make it an additional difficulty, or at least give some way to access the original. WD never did either, and if anything screwed over the easier settings with limits on how far you can go and whatnot.

I think their best gameplay adjustments are the ones no one even noticed. Did you ever remember reading about how they increased the damage some Alundra bosses dealt but decreased their total HP, so the battles would be difficult because of your endurance rather than because of the enemy's?  SO GRATEFUL FOR THAT. ;_; I didn't play the original Japanese version, but considering how much HP they have even after WD decreased it, the change could only be for the better.

Also, remember how they reduced the difficulty of Borgan in Eternal Blue on the Sega CD? He was still one of the hardest RPG bosses ever, even after their changes. (We're not talking about the totally nerfed version of Borgan that appeared in the Playstation version, mind you.)

But yes, Working Designs totally F'ed up their share of games with gameplay alterations, too. Case in point: charging Magic EXP to save your game in Eternal Blue Sega CD. In addition to being ill-advised, they screwed up the ratios: saving at the start of the game set you back a LOT, whereas later on the MEXP cost was negligible.

Also, the entirety of Vay. (They changed the 2 MP basic healing spell to cost 10 MP instead. Need I say more?)
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ronhelig
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« Reply #19 on: July 06, 2006, 08:51:17 AM »

Like him or not though, he brought over RPG's that would otherwise never have seen the light of day in the USA.  They weren't always the greatest choices granted, but at least we got them.  I miss him and hope he makes an announcement soon about SOMETHING.  Even if just about the evolution of man.
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Robert Boyd
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« Reply #20 on: July 07, 2006, 02:31:23 AM »

Quote from: "Radien"
I didn't hate Victor Ireland, but I think his status is probably something that we don't really need to think about anymore. Whether you liked their translations or not, Working Designs used a questionable business model that probably wasn't to Vic's credit. That's what ultimately turned me off to them: the knowledge that if I didn't have the cash to fork over for one of their games right when it came out, I would probably have to pay a higher cost later on to find myself a copy. Vic came right out and proudly stated, once, that he intentionally kept supplies low in order make sure their games' resell prices stayed high.  It was a rather egotistical move that sacrificed sales AND cost consumers more money. How did this benefit us or the industry? I didn't like it.


Actually, Atlus does the exact same thing.  They intentionally keep supply low so that they can be assured of selling out on most games thus keeping their risk level low.  It also has the benefit of enticing people into buying their games right at launch instead of waiting for the inevitable (with most other companies' products) price drop.
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Radien
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« Reply #21 on: July 07, 2006, 07:12:58 AM »

Quote from: "Robert Boyd"
Actually, Atlus does the exact same thing.  They intentionally keep supply low so that they can be assured of selling out on most games thus keeping their risk level low.  It also has the benefit of enticing people into buying their games right at launch instead of waiting for the inevitable (with most other companies' products) price drop.


Hmm. When you word it that way, it makes a bit more sense, for small-time companies. But when Vic explained it in his interview, the only thing he mentioned was the visible value of existing copies. The resell value of a game has no direct affect on the company's profits once production has stopped. Thus, it made it sound like they were intentionally taking a cut on a game that could earn more, solely to keep the price up.

Perhaps he thought that sounded better to the consumer, but it didn't sound better to me at all.

Personally, I'm fine if the price doesn't drop much over time, if it's something I definitely want to play. But if the price goes up, or if used copies cost the same as the original did new, or if the price was way too high to begin with and doesn't go down, then I have a negative incentive to buy.

Also, I'd wager to say that the packaging extras added more risk than anything else, much as I loved them...
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ronhelig
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« Reply #22 on: July 07, 2006, 08:57:30 AM »

The thing that boggles my mind is that Vic said the final straw was when Sony wouldn't approve their translation of Goemon.  I was just wondering why anyone thinks Sony would do that, or do you think Vic is blowing smoke and using Sony as a scapegoat?  There are far worse games available on these shores that obviously passed their approval testing.
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Dade
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« Reply #23 on: July 07, 2006, 12:57:05 PM »

Me thinks he was blowing smoke and using Sony as an excuse.

Seriously, who here was fucking excited for Goemon? No one. Goemon only exists in my mind as one game....and a really shitty N64 game it is.

Who here was fucking excited for Arc the Lad collection and Growlancer Generations? A lot of people.

Vic ran a company that did a lot of good....but releasing one or two games every couple years just makes a company loose a lot of steam, and only management can fix that.
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Eusis
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« Reply #24 on: July 07, 2006, 01:35:33 PM »

Quote from: "ronhelig"
Like him or not though, he brought over RPG's that would otherwise never have seen the light of day in the USA.  They weren't always the greatest choices granted, but at least we got them.  I miss him and hope he makes an announcement soon about SOMETHING.  Even if just about the evolution of man.

It's why I don't truly hate the company and whatnot - more annoyed every so often than anything else. They were ahead of everyone during the 16 bit generation and much of the 32-bit. But with this generation, they kinda slipped behind while other companies like Atlus and NIS America took up their torch, but did almost everything as good or better for the most part.
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Radien
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« Reply #25 on: July 07, 2006, 06:15:31 PM »

Quote from: "Dade"
Seriously, who here was fucking excited for Goemon? No one. Goemon only exists in my mind as one game....and a really shitty N64 game it is.

Who here was fucking excited for Arc the Lad collection and Growlancer Generations? A lot of people.

True, true. I remember seeing Vic's Goemon avatar and thinking "what the hell IS that?"...

To their credit, though, I tried out Alundra purely because of Working Designs name recognition, and absolutely loved it, even though it's become incredibly obscure (cry).

One of these days I'm going to have to get my hands on a copy of Growlanser Generations...
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vanexel
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« Reply #26 on: July 16, 2006, 10:03:20 PM »

I'm not done bringing JRPGs to the US yet. Keep an eye on gaijinworks.com and we should have something more interesting than a placeholder there by the Fall." So for all the RPG fans out there who are fans of Working Designs, at least there's some light at the end of the tunnel and hopefully this new company will be able to bring US RPG fans some fresh new Japanese RPGs for some of the current systems.

It seems that Victor Ireland has a new company or some sorts so maybe we might see another Lunar in the future.
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mrhaboobi
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« Reply #27 on: July 18, 2006, 07:16:32 PM »

I wish there was a company that could get us DQV :) I wonder if thats something Vic would have done for ps2.  I'd love to get my hands on some of his Turbo Grafx collection aswell :)
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Radien
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« Reply #28 on: July 18, 2006, 10:32:31 PM »

Quote from: "vanexel"
It seems that Victor Ireland has a new company or some sorts so maybe we might see another Lunar in the future.

Good for him... but that has no effect on whether we'll see another Lunar. Considering the fact that the DS Lunar made it to the U.S., I'm willing to bet that another main Lunar installment will make it here if it is ever made in Japan.

The question, however, is whether that will happen. Thus far, the likely answer is "no." (at least, it is if you want a Lunar 3, as opposed to Lunar sidequests like Lunar DS and Lunar Magic School, and remakes like Lunar Legend)

Perhaps it would be better to focus on Grandia. At least that series is alive and well.
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« Reply #29 on: July 19, 2006, 05:43:39 AM »

Interesting enough, if Game Arts decides to release another Lunar, I would not be too surprised if Square-Enix releases it, since they do have decent relations.  

Also people looking forward to older games coming out here, I don't want to disappoint but don't hold your breath.  Lots of Japanese companies delete the codecase for a game after its done, and they no longer wish to continue using the code, in the end the only way is ROM hacking, which is unpredicatable and very annoying.  This is why a lot of those Saturn to PSP ports aren't making it here, they run on an emu with iso on it.
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