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Author Topic: Is Square-Enix out of talent?  (Read 19508 times)
Yggdrasil
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« Reply #15 on: June 10, 2010, 04:54:51 PM »

I forgot to mention that the big "problem" that is really annoying to me is that, I see that S.E. is a huge company that is capable to make huge and fun games. But personally, I don't see enough talent or passion put into their games (that's debatable I know). And to think that they have enough money and manpower to make that to happen and they just keep making lackluster games is really annoying... but, I'll give my last chance with them with the new Parasite Eve and Versus XIII.

And sadly, I don't have a DS to enjoy TWEWY or a iPhone for Chaos Rings. I've read good things about these two. Maybe in the future, hopefully.

Sorry if the previous post has to harsh. ._.'
« Last Edit: June 10, 2010, 05:09:47 PM by Yggdrasil » Logged
Farron
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« Reply #16 on: June 10, 2010, 05:07:47 PM »

Well, TWEWY says no for one thing.
I was about to say just that!

From the last 10 years, from Square that I:
- really enjoyed: FFX, FFX-2, Valkyrie Profile 2, FFXIII, The World Ends With You.

- though were okay (not that good, aren't all that bad): Dragon Quest VIII, Star Ocean 3, FF Tactics Advance 2, FFVII Crises Core, Star Ocean 4 (so far as I've played), Fullmetal Alchemist (I think it was the 2nd), VP Covenant of the Plume (could have been much better), Dissidia (I wish I liked it more, but something didn't 'sparkle' with me), Dragon Quest V (almost went the the good list)

- really bad: Last Remnant, Kingdom Hearts 1 (mostly bad gameplay and controls), Final Fantasy XI (total grind fest), Crystal Defenders ( a wasted opportunity to make a good game)

There are some games I played too little to give a proper comment or a few other I just forgot, but overall, most of the games for me at least are in the Great and Okay range so I would not worry.
Instead of saying some games were just plain bad, I'd say they were disappointments! If we'd talk about those, then I could fill a pool.
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Sagacious-T
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« Reply #17 on: June 10, 2010, 05:08:40 PM »

Handheld games aside, Square Enix just doesn't put out the same level of games that Squaresoft did.

It's not rose tinted goggles either. I played games like Chrono Trigger, Secret of Mana, and Final Fantasy 9 much, much later, and I can honestly attest to having more fun with those games than FF12 or FF13. There's just so much heart that goes into these older games.

I remember an old quote where someone from old Squaresoft commented on Chrono Trigger compared to newer games. He said back in the day, they would just go with ideas and make the best game possible since they had no established fanbase yet, and that now since games are bigger projects the focus is less on freedom of ideas and more on appealing to the market. It's a shame.
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Aeolus
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« Reply #18 on: June 10, 2010, 05:28:33 PM »

There's been a pretty significant drop in quality since the PS1 era, that is obvious.

You mean like the quality found in Xenogear's Disk 2 sitting room, or Chrono Cross's Wall-o-plot-text that still didn't explain anything, or even that pretty but bland as hell side-scrolling beat 'em up called Legend of Mana.

And then you have the other side of the equation from Enix which includes a menagerie of bugs, errors, exploits, and pain also known as Star Ocean 2, the answer to how long is too long also known as Dragon Warrior VII.

If so then they sure were hitting a high batting average back then. Granted though, Tri-Ace did get ridiculously lucky on Valkyrie Profile and Vagrant Story made for an awesome prelude to a series that will never exist. And then there's the SaGa series, but well, when was the last time a SaGa game did all that it set out to do?

In all fairness though I should mention both FFT and FFIX since both of those games were solid. And I suppose that there are a few others out there worth mentioning but I haven't played them yet so whatever, I'll leave it up to those who feel it necessary to correct me lest the universe falls out of balance to fill in the blanks.
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CDFN
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« Reply #19 on: June 10, 2010, 05:35:20 PM »

Handheld games aside, Square Enix just doesn't put out the same level of games that Squaresoft did.

It's not rose tinted goggles either. I played games like Chrono Trigger, Secret of Mana, and Final Fantasy 9 much, much later, and I can honestly attest to having more fun with those games than FF12 or FF13. There's just so much heart that goes into these older games.

I remember an old quote where someone from old Squaresoft commented on Chrono Trigger compared to newer games. He said back in the day, they would just go with ideas and make the best game possible since they had no established fanbase yet, and that now since games are bigger projects the focus is less on freedom of ideas and more on appealing to the market. It's a shame.

You just can't expect that from such a big company, this is a business, you make a game that can reach the company's projected sales or you lose your job, it's that simple. It's not about what the creator of the game likes, or his vision or whatever you wanna call it, it's about what sells at that point in time.
Frankly, I think it's a miracle that sony is putting such a huge budget behind the last guardian after the ridiculous sales of team ico's previous games, it's a blessing for gamers that aren't in this just for online shooters. It's a shame that studios like clover didn't get the same kind of support.
If you want heart in your games forget SE and support Atlus. Hell, who knows if one day SMT becomes so big that they'll be forced to appeal to the call of duty fanbase and shoji meguro will be forced to work with leona lewis.
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Lord Scottish
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« Reply #20 on: June 10, 2010, 05:39:34 PM »

^I am now envisioning an SMT game set in the Iraq war. And it is glorious.
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Sagacious-T
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« Reply #21 on: June 10, 2010, 05:41:09 PM »

Actually I would think bigger companies would be more willing to take risks. Hell, you could say they did take a risk with FF13's design structure. The game still sold millions on brand name alone. if anything I want them to take less risks and make what they were once good at, some damn good JRPGs. A main "Final Fantasy" game is going to sell. The brand name strength Square-Enix has is staggering.
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Aeolus
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« Reply #22 on: June 10, 2010, 05:43:52 PM »

If you want heart in your games forget SE and support Atlus.

I would if they would just loving localize Growlanser already.
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« Reply #23 on: June 10, 2010, 05:50:56 PM »

Actually I would think bigger companies would be more willing to take risks. Hell, you could say they did take a risk with FF13's design structure. The game still sold millions on brand name alone. if anything I want them to take less risks and make what they were once good at, some damn good JRPGs. A main "Final Fantasy" game is going to sell. The brand name strength Square-Enix has is staggering.

Big companies need a lot of money to function and in today's economy thinks can go south really fast. Big companies have to answer to stockholders and they don't care if a game had a lot of heart if it didn't sell. They didn't take any risks with XIII, come on. The game is clearly designed for mass market appeal and the sales prove it.
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« Reply #24 on: June 10, 2010, 05:57:16 PM »

Yes but this is Final Fantasy we're talking about, not God Hand. Regardless of FF13's design being the way it currently is, or being based on the design of FF 6 through 10, it would still sell millions of copies. Do you think a gamer goes to a store and sees "Hey, the new FF13 game. I heard they removed all the towns and made it more mainstream for guys like me!"? Fuck no. They see "Oh shit its Motherfucking Final Fantasy 13, I am going to buy this game regardless of it being a heaping pile of shit."

I just want a good game. FF12 and FF13 have been the worst SNES-era onwards Final Fantasy games I have ever played.
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Yggdrasil
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« Reply #25 on: June 10, 2010, 06:00:21 PM »

Maybe the problem is that we want too much for the games we want to play, not to mention that now anyone can read heavy spoilers, gameplay mechanics and what not of a game before it's even release.

For instance, I'm grateful that Square Enix has so much secret around Versus XIII for example. No news is good news.
« Last Edit: June 10, 2010, 06:05:09 PM by Yggdrasil » Logged
Parn
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« Reply #26 on: June 10, 2010, 06:03:11 PM »

I had nothing but high expectations with Mass Effect 2.  Save a few minor quirks, Bioware either met, or surpassed all of them.

So no, that's really not it.
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Lard
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« Reply #27 on: June 10, 2010, 06:08:49 PM »

You mean like the quality found in Xenogear's Disk 2 sitting room, or Chrono Cross's Wall-o-plot-text that still didn't explain anything, or even that pretty but bland as hell side-scrolling beat 'em up called Legend of Mana.

There will be no badmouthing of LOM thankyewverymuch.
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Yggdrasil
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« Reply #28 on: June 10, 2010, 06:18:46 PM »

I had nothing but high expectations with Mass Effect 2.  Save a few minor quirks, Bioware either met, or surpassed all of them.

So no, that's really not it.

Yeah, you're right. But I still think that the "hype train" can kill a game sometimes.
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MeshGearFox
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« Reply #29 on: June 10, 2010, 06:29:03 PM »

Can you run out of something you never had?
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