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Author Topic: WoW: Horde to get Paladins, Alliance Shamans  (Read 4332 times)
Cauton
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« on: July 21, 2006, 01:17:45 PM »

Blood elf Paladins, Draeni Shamans. This is crazy. Now the only real difference between the two factions is gone. Now the choice which side you'll play on is going to be purely cosmetic.
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« Reply #1 on: July 21, 2006, 01:40:09 PM »

lol.  wow, blizzard really didn't want to get off their lazy ass and think of an idea besides this.  I wonder what all the "omg I'm quitting horde imbalance is unfairz!" and "solutions to pve imbalance" topics will turn into?

after reading a bit of posts, i like this quote:

"Possibly the biggest copout to fixing a broken game mechanic in the history of gaming."
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« Reply #2 on: July 21, 2006, 02:45:59 PM »

I don't really view this as a cop-out right now, though it certainly has the potential to be.  A lot of people seem to be looking at it from today's game balance, in that sure if you had today's Paladin and Shaman competing for the same raid slot, you take the Paladin.

But now you can better individualize each class because you won't have to listen about PVP EASZ MODZ from a bunch of 11 year-old fucktards who wouldn't know what a preform is if they were Shadowmeld-AimedShotted in the ballsack (which wouldn't do anything because the balls haven't dropped yet).  You can give Shaman Bloodlust and mess with totem mechanics.  You can play with Paladin DPS and tanking viability.  You can make more involved PvE encounters.  You don't have to keep nerfing Grounding Totem every time a boss casts a spell it can actually absorb.  This is a PvE boost for the Horde, a PuG PvP boost for the Alliance, and an organized PvP boost for the Horde.

I mean sure, parts of it are the easy way out, but if combined with even halfway good rereviews of Paladins and Shaman for the expansion, it's a huge improvement to the game.

---

Oh shit I just found out I'm Eyonix:
"First of all, we plan to allow most of the Shaman and Paladin buff effects to stack, with a few exceptions of course. This means that both will be extremely useful in regards to improving the potential power level of those around them. Beyond this, you're only thinking in current "WoW" terms and seem to only be digesting current end-game. When the Burning Crusade releases all classes will have access to new spells, talents and abilities, which will be taken advantage of (and play a large part in) grouping/raiding in the expansion's end-game.

It's also important to note that moving forward, we'll be able to design our raid and dungeon encounters to specifically draw out the strengths of each of these classes, whereas now we actually take measures to prevent an encounter from being too beneficial to only one of the classes. "
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Iolaus
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« Reply #3 on: July 21, 2006, 03:19:06 PM »

Too be perfectly honest, why is there any reason to complain at all? Just play whatever you want to play. If you feel that playing a Horde paladin is a sell out maneuver, then don't play it. I mean christ. All this really does is balance the entire pvp and game for that matter. PVP in the game is more or less chaotic anyway. I personally don't mind the change at all myself, seeing as I'll be playing purely Horde on Norgannon. I cannot stand the look of trolls, so the Bloodelf addition will be a nice alternative.
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Dade
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« Reply #4 on: July 21, 2006, 03:19:47 PM »

Well.....everyone was wondering if Blizz was going to unveil any new classes and in a lot of interviews they kept saying "You'll have to wait and see...."

...

Wow way to be original asswipes! Not that I'm really that bummed, cause I really like the Paladin class but I also love me some Night Elves. I guess Blood Elf Paladin is the next best thing. I'm happy, but very irritated at the lack of creativity.

Edit: Ya know, now that I've thought about it for a few minutes....why didnt Blizzard just go with the typical Anti-Paladin style and introduce a Shadowknight or Reaver style class (in the fashion of EQ and DAoC, respectively) and a "Blatantly Hippy" class for the alliance to counter the Shaman? Would it be really that hard to make a Tank with light DPS capability but with great DoT abilities?

*le sigh*
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« Reply #5 on: July 21, 2006, 04:51:54 PM »

I've got no real complaint about this.  A blood elf paladin will make my collection of Horde alts complete. :P

Quote from: "Dade"

Edit: Ya know, now that I've thought about it for a few minutes....why didnt Blizzard just go with the typical Anti-Paladin style and introduce a Shadowknight or Reaver style class (in the fashion of EQ and DAoC, respectively) and a "Blatantly Hippy" class for the alliance to counter the Shaman? Would it be really that hard to make a Tank with light DPS capability but with great DoT abilities?

*le sigh*


You know what's sad?  They could actually do something like that and have it still fit into the Warcraft "lore":  death knights for the win, baby. :P
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« Reply #6 on: July 21, 2006, 06:00:43 PM »

Quote from: "Dade"
Edit: Ya know, now that I've thought about it for a few minutes....why didnt Blizzard just go with the typical Anti-Paladin style and introduce a Shadowknight or Reaver style class (in the fashion of EQ and DAoC, respectively) and a "Blatantly Hippy" class for the alliance to counter the Shaman? Would it be really that hard to make a Tank with light DPS capability but with great DoT abilities?


As a result of this, I wonder if Shaman / Paladins will become less solo friendly since their buffs will be scaled down?

Anyways, qft.  If they did this though, they'd have to think up of some new abilities (while keeping the things, like blessings and totems, intact) and probably new armor sets.  I'd like to see it anyways.

But, regardless of all the bitching going on, it'll be good in the long run.  Like some of you have already mentioned, it'll stop the whole "easy mode" shit people keep saying and pvp will perhaps become more balanced.
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« Reply #7 on: July 21, 2006, 08:48:23 PM »

Lore go down the hole.  Though personally I'm pretty stoked about this, paladins are soooooooooooo much better in PVE than shamans.  I may just make my main BE expansion character a paladin now, lolol.  Though really, I don't get it.  How do you explain a demonic race being attuned to the light still?

Edit: http://forums.worldofwarcraft.com/thread.aspx?fn=wow-general&t=9168811&p=1&tmp=1#post9168811
is so right on so many levels.
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« Reply #8 on: July 21, 2006, 10:07:05 PM »

Quote from: "Dade"
Well.....everyone was wondering if Blizz was going to unveil any new classes and in a lot of interviews they kept saying "You'll have to wait and see...."

...

Wow way to be original asswipes! Not that I'm really that bummed, cause I really like the Paladin class but I also love me some Night Elves. I guess Blood Elf Paladin is the next best thing. I'm happy, but very irritated at the lack of creativity.

Edit: Ya know, now that I've thought about it for a few minutes....why didnt Blizzard just go with the typical Anti-Paladin style and introduce a Shadowknight or Reaver style class (in the fashion of EQ and DAoC, respectively) and a "Blatantly Hippy" class for the alliance to counter the Shaman? Would it be really that hard to make a Tank with light DPS capability but with great DoT abilities?

*le sigh*


They never once said there would be new classes. They actually said there would NOT be new classes in this expansion. They never said anything about maintaining the current balance of classes on each side.
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« Reply #9 on: July 22, 2006, 01:26:59 PM »

Quote from: "Daggerstrike"
They never once said there would be new classes. They actually said there would NOT be new classes in this expansion. They never said anything about maintaining the current balance of classes on each side.

This doesn't mean the end, either. I mean, they could still bring out new classes to give each faction the unique choice they had before.

... Eh, who knows. All I know is that WSG won't be a Horde-dominated BG anymore. Haha!
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« Reply #10 on: July 22, 2006, 01:48:21 PM »

Quote from: "Dio"
... Eh, who knows. All I know is that WSG won't be a Horde-dominated BG anymore. Haha!


I really don't think Shamans have anything to do with Horde winning WSG.  Paladins have mail/plate + shields, quick easy buffs, and best of all (for wsg), blessing of freedom.  I've seen servers where it goes both way.  I don't think there's any real inherent advantage (besides the fact that Horde seem to have a smaller percentage of idiots).

Yeah, Shamans have purge.  So do Priests.  Paladins get it later as well, but it's not as effective.

Back on topic, one thing that does scream unfair is the blood elf racial + Paladins.  Paladins that have an aoe silence plus a drain mana racial?  daaaamn.
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« Reply #11 on: July 22, 2006, 08:25:56 PM »

Quote from: "Dio"
All I know is that WSG won't be a Horde-dominated BG anymore. Haha!


That has nothing to do with paladins vs. shamans so much as too few alliance working together.  When my horde teams go up against an alliance group that works together towards winning and not farming HKs (which is what most of the alliance groups on my server do), we get rolled almost without exception.

I wanted to see how universal a phenomenon this was, so I went to a random match on my 60 paladin.  We already lost and more than half of the team had not joined the raid group and those who had concocted no plan to deal with the opposition before losing 3-0.

Let me put this in perspective.  One WSG match a few of our premade horde group got a little antsy and started a WSG group via single queue.  Unfortunately, that meant when the rest of the group was ready to start, half of the team or so was already stuck in a WSG.  So the rest of our group single queued for that and alliance just finished capping their second flag (I guess it isn't too hard to take out 4 horde with 10 alliance :p).  At this point I said that we should just give them the last cap and go to the next game, but someone else said we should at least try for one.

8 minutes later we won 3-2 with me capping 3 times in a row.  I don't remember how many shamans we had, but it wasn't as many as all their DPSadins, I'm sure.  Basically, when they could zerg, the alliance did fine.  But when they ran up against a strategy, they were obliterated because everyone was trying to farm honor instead of adapting to the fair match.  This had nothing to do with classes but rather faction.
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« Reply #12 on: July 23, 2006, 03:25:54 AM »

Paladins are much more powerful support in both WSG and AB than a Shaman could ever be.  Paladins are the single best flag escorting class in the game: a healer that can't die and that can dispell just about every debuff in existence.  The common HORDEPVPEZMODE meme has always only applied to PuGs, and even less so with current progression levels than before.  Preform PvP is quite another beast entirely.
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« Reply #13 on: July 24, 2006, 01:36:42 PM »

When it comes to AV and AB, Shamans don't really turn the tide of the BG's, but with WSG, they really turn the tide because Earth Bind Totems + Ghost Wolf = Win... Personally, I hate all CTF games, anyway.
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« Reply #14 on: July 24, 2006, 02:21:26 PM »

Quote from: "Dio"
When it comes to AV and AB, Shamans don't really turn the tide of the BG's, but with WSG, they really turn the tide because Earth Bind Totems + Ghost Wolf = Win... Personally, I hate all CTF games, anyway.


As a semi-regular member of one of the best Horde pre-forms on my server, I say with some confidence that this is only true in PuG games.  Earthbind is a good WSG totem, to be sure, but trivial to deal with for a halfway decent team, and Ghost Wolf is simply not a viable flagrunning tool, even now that it can be Nature's Swiftnessed.
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