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Author Topic: Dissidia Duodecim Final Fantasy announced for PSP.  (Read 7085 times)
Yggdrasil
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« on: September 07, 2010, 10:07:37 PM »

from NeoGAF:

Quote from: duckroll
It's in Jump. Due in 2011. Kain and Lightning shown.

Here's the "leaked" scan.
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Farron
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« Reply #1 on: September 07, 2010, 10:55:20 PM »

If they put Rikku in, then it's settled, I'll get it !
Especially because I didn't get much sucked in the first one. I guess I picked the "boring" characters to start the game and ended up giving it up.
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Sagacious-T
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« Reply #2 on: September 07, 2010, 10:58:37 PM »

Ehrgeiz is still better
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insertnamehere
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« Reply #3 on: September 07, 2010, 11:39:18 PM »

i'd be excited about this if that first one didn't have a stupid plot.
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Kevadu
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« Reply #4 on: September 08, 2010, 12:05:16 AM »

I hated the first game.  Awful story aside (it's a cross-over, what did you expect?), I felt like the combat system combined the absolute worst aspects of both RPGs and fighting games with none of the positive aspects.  It was a pointless grindfest where the outcome of fights was determined far more by your level than your skill, only you were fighting the same handful of opponents over and over so there wasn't even any variety there.

Seriously, WTH do people see in this game?
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Cyril
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« Reply #5 on: September 08, 2010, 12:11:57 AM »

the outcome of fights was determined far more by your level than your skill

Completely untrue statement here, very misinformed.  Try turning the difficulty up and you'll see how absolutely insignificant your level will be.

I admit that it can be a grindfest, however.
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Kevadu
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« Reply #6 on: September 08, 2010, 12:40:18 AM »

the outcome of fights was determined far more by your level than your skill

Completely untrue statement here, very misinformed.  Try turning the difficulty up and you'll see how absolutely insignificant your level will be.

I admit that it can be a grindfest, however.

Your two statements are incompatible.  Maybe turning up the difficulty makes fighting weaker enemies more challenging, but that's not my main issue.  What I hated was how fighting enemies more than a couple of levels above your own was virtually impossible.  For starters I'm pretty sure the AI starts cheating when there is a level gap like that since they will just perfectly dodge and counter everything you throw at them (which is not the case when you fight the same opponent after you've level-up'ed a few times), however that can be overcome to some degree.  You will never hit with your first attack but if you chain attacks just right you can hit with subsequent ones.  But even then there is such a massive discrepency in the damage done that there is little hope of ever winning.  I remember attempting such a fight more than once where I was able to slowly wittle away at my opponents health--doing like 1% damage with each hit--for several minutes before a single slip-up let them counterattack and kill me in literally one or two hits.

To top this all off the game has an experience system that offers no reward for taking on a difficult opponent.  Most of the experience you get comes from bonuses for doing things like finishing the fight quickly or without getting hit and not from the quality of your opponent, actively encouraging you to spend all your time beating up weaker enemies rather than challenging yourself.  And if you want to get all the treasures and crap scattering around the boards then again you have to play throw the same scenarios again and again and completely dominate your opponents, which is only really possible if you are over-leveled for them.  That's just poor game design.
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Yggdrasil
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« Reply #7 on: September 08, 2010, 12:50:33 AM »

Seriously, WTH do people see in this game?

It has FINAL FANTASY in the title.
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Jotacon
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« Reply #8 on: September 08, 2010, 03:03:50 AM »

Actually, I'm pretty excited after hearing this. I had a lot of fun with Dissidia although it was best played with other people like any other fighting game. My biggest problem with the game was once I got out of it, I couldn't get back in.

As for the gameplay, I LOVED fighting high level opponents because it was a challenge. In story mode they made had it so that those fights had harder AI, but they were all beatable with the right application of skills and abilities. The customization for moves was really attractive to me, so I really hope they expand on that as it more limited than I would have liked. Another thing was that playing through the campaign I found you never had to grind, to get the best stuff you would have to play through the board again, but I only did that for specific items or characters (I mained Firion so I played his levels lots).

Leveling up the Villians however was a pain. More grind than necessary. I have to agree with Kevadu that it suffered from some bad design decision, though. The sequel needs to take a look at what other fighters do to make the game better in a competitive enviroment. I'm definately not the best guy to say this, but that game was not balanced all that well and I would like to be able to use Kefka next time.

And/or look into Pokemon and have different abilities and move sets change stat growth. That'll fuck the balance attempts right up (or help it, I dont know), but it'd be more RPG-esque and possibly more fun.
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« Reply #9 on: September 08, 2010, 05:01:47 AM »

I *just* learned the word "duodecim" (twelve?) from Blazblue: Continuum Shift.

Now I get to use it in the context of an FF game. Win!
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Cyril
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« Reply #10 on: September 08, 2010, 05:03:03 AM »

the outcome of fights was determined far more by your level than your skill

Completely untrue statement here, very misinformed.  Try turning the difficulty up and you'll see how absolutely insignificant your level will be.

I admit that it can be a grindfest, however.

Your two statements are incompatible.  Maybe turning up the difficulty makes fighting weaker enemies more challenging, but that's not my main issue.  What I hated was how fighting enemies more than a couple of levels above your own was virtually impossible.  For starters I'm pretty sure the AI starts cheating when there is a level gap like that since they will just perfectly dodge and counter everything you throw at them (which is not the case when you fight the same opponent after you've level-up'ed a few times), however that can be overcome to some degree.  You will never hit with your first attack but if you chain attacks just right you can hit with subsequent ones.  But even then there is such a massive discrepency in the damage done that there is little hope of ever winning.  I remember attempting such a fight more than once where I was able to slowly wittle away at my opponents health--doing like 1% damage with each hit--for several minutes before a single slip-up let them counterattack and kill me in literally one or two hits.

To top this all off the game has an experience system that offers no reward for taking on a difficult opponent.  Most of the experience you get comes from bonuses for doing things like finishing the fight quickly or without getting hit and not from the quality of your opponent, actively encouraging you to spend all your time beating up weaker enemies rather than challenging yourself.  And if you want to get all the treasures and crap scattering around the boards then again you have to play throw the same scenarios again and again and completely dominate your opponents, which is only really possible if you are over-leveled for them.  That's just poor game design.

I have to wonder how much of Dissidia you played to be making comments like this? Did you just beat the storyline quests and not get into the actual meat of the game? The meat doesn't actually come until after you've hit the point where you can beat Chaos a second time (The level ~100 Chaos, not the weaker one).

First, allow me to clarify my original "grindfest" comment.  if you're like me and want to do everything and get everything, you need to grind.  For hours.  For hundreds of hours.  You will be doing hundreds of battles in the colosseums for rare items you can only get there.  The game is a complete and utter grindfest when it comes to making gear.

Every point you make in the last comment is pretty much void when you consider where you'll be spending the most of your post-game time: Colosseum mode.  Yes, you get rewarded for choosing the stronger opponents.  Harder opponents generally give you better rewards.  You can't always control the stages, and sometimes both you and your opponents have random status effects that you have to deal with.  Yes, you get rewarded for beating (certain) enemies very quickly.  After a point you can have the best gear and the highest level and still die to a normal enemy because you made a mistake.

As for the first comment, Hmm, I can't really say if that's right or wrong, since I haven't been at that point for quite some time.  But I do remember killing level 15 enemies with a level 1 character rather easily after a point, but that's when you have good gear.  Gear makes all the difference in the world, far moreso than levels. Gear that I did have to spend quite some time grinding for (hence the "grindfest" comment).

Well, I suppose the point is that you shouldn't judge the game until you've really gotten into it.  This title actually does resemble a fighting game in that it's just starting once you've beaten the main storyline.  You certainly wouldn't expect to beat the main storyline in, say, Soul Calibur and expect to know everything about the game. 

So while I'm not denying your points, they also don't hold up for the entire playtime.
« Last Edit: September 08, 2010, 05:24:47 AM by Cyril » Logged
CDFN
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« Reply #11 on: September 08, 2010, 07:37:15 AM »

I didn't like the first one.

"I want to create a world filled with roses"

I almost puked all over my psp. I like fighting games but not this particular subgenre where you have huge arenas and are able to fly all over the place and shit. But yeah, I honestly think that this game has the absolute worst dialogue ever in a game.
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ShadowLaguna
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« Reply #12 on: September 08, 2010, 08:16:09 AM »

I still think it would better on a non-portable console.
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Kevadu
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« Reply #13 on: September 08, 2010, 12:21:52 PM »

I put about 10 hours into the game before I realized I wasn't having even a spec of fun playing it so I stopped.  Maybe it does get good after a hundred hours, but I don't give a shit.  That's like the FFXIII argument only even worse.  Why should I play a game in which I have to spend that kind of time slogging through tedium before it gets good?  Frankly speaking, I want my 10 hours back.
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Aeolus
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« Reply #14 on: September 08, 2010, 07:44:34 PM »

Lets hope Celes and Tifa make it into this version.
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In my vision, I see that one of us is going to KO the other.
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