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Author Topic: Female gamers, is this industry treating you as well as you deserve?  (Read 2773 times)
Starmongoose
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« Reply #15 on: March 26, 2011, 04:50:27 PM »

No way Yoda, he really does have a girlfriend. Tim Minchin even wrote a song about her


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=e6raVzrbqrM
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« Reply #16 on: March 26, 2011, 05:30:48 PM »

As a female gamer,I am heavily offended
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« Reply #17 on: March 26, 2011, 08:41:11 PM »

As a female gamer,I am heavily offended

Go make me a sandwich!
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MindCandy
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« Reply #18 on: March 26, 2011, 11:55:32 PM »

Duke is an asshole, that's part of the gag.

Honestly though, I'm insulted by some of this as a male. I get the impression that some of these guys think a short skirt or huge rack will awaken my homer simpson gene and make me buy their game, or that some meat in a bikini next to a booth (which is what they are hired to be, even if they are intelligent women) will turn me into a drooling cave man who will now put my stamp of approval on whatever it is you're selling.

Taken further, and more in line with the topic, I think that THEY think they can further appeal to me in some way by insulting, demeaning, and sexualizing women. As if I'm more inlined to pay them whatever it is they are looking for (time, money, attention) if they spit in a woman's face in front of me. As if I have not progressed beyond the mentality of women as second class citizens, or as if I harbor some gender based prejudice. I personally find that very insulting.
« Last Edit: March 27, 2011, 12:06:53 AM by MindCandy » Logged

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« Reply #19 on: March 27, 2011, 11:54:18 AM »

Yeah, I kinda laugh because it is Duke Nukem; otherwise it does depend on the context.  I'm sad about the lack of female leads in big titles.... this also excludes all attempts at female-oriented gaming that stars Hannah Montana or some living Disney woman.

What I hate more is the over-sexualization of female subjects.  A bit of sex-appeal I get, but too many titles make it an explicit point.  I'm not going to go burn my bra in from of these game companies, of course, but I do a lot of eye-rolling nowadays...
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« Reply #20 on: April 01, 2011, 05:50:04 AM »

Here are 2 more articles regarding the subject, this time from IGN:

http://uk.pc.ign.com/articles/114/1143124p1.html

"I recently got a female friend of mine into World of Warcraft (sorry), and as we sat there, playing together, she turned to me and asked "what's with all the gigantic boobs?""

http://uk.pc.ign.com/articles/115/1158788p1.html

"males too suffer from unrealistic body standards."

"You can see the symptoms of this mentality whenever a girl speaks over voice-chat. Invariably the male audience is split into those who instantly assume she is/will be useless at the game, or is dying for some disgusting nerd lovin'."



The second article contains a link to a blog, it's written by a woman (Anna Kreider) and is dedicated exclusively to this subject:

http://gomakemeasandwich.wordpress.com/
« Last Edit: April 01, 2011, 06:01:00 AM by CDFN » Logged

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« Reply #21 on: April 01, 2011, 06:35:46 AM »

^
Thanks for the new links, I'll read them in a minute.

And thanks OP, that was an interesting article.

As a female gamer, I too feel offended by such examples wether it's Dukem or another game. Like, it feels very awkward when I'm trying a God of War game out and it has 2 naked women in them that you can fuck...

It has always bothered me, this issue. When I was younger (around the time I was 15-17) I thought I could change the perspective of how women are treated by participating in forums and raising my voice. How silly of me to think that one person could make a difference in guys dominated hobby. I still participate and show my dissatisfaction but I know it won't change a thing. We're in 2011 now, I'm 22 and even though you see more and more female gamers on forums, the companies didn't become more respectful and reserved towards women, it became worse. Dead or Alive games being worse, Soul Calibur games having bigger boobs and suggestive clothes after each new entry, characters like Bayonetta being made, Ninja Gaiden Sigma 2 having a naked female sitting on the floor and filled with blood etc. 

And all the Japanese shit is bothering me as well, where you have games you can rape women. Moe characters and all that crap as well.

I mean, what is catering to women? Female gamers aren't asking for games being made for them in mind, just be respectful about the women you make and don't assume that all gamers are guys.
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« Reply #22 on: April 01, 2011, 06:53:34 AM »

dont give up rpgn! though sometimes i think trying to change peoples minds about things like this with words is like trying to get through to a racist with words alone.

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« Reply #23 on: April 01, 2011, 07:21:44 AM »

^
Thanks for the new links, I'll read them in a minute.

And thanks OP, that was an interesting article.



That would be me and... me :-)

Yesterday I was playing the Tomb Raider Trilogy and my wife couldn't help but notice Lara's interesting choice of clothing to climb mountains lol.
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« Reply #24 on: April 01, 2011, 07:59:45 AM »

dont give up rpgn! though sometimes i think trying to change peoples minds about things like this with words is like trying to get through to a racist with words alone.


You are right, but I didn't know what else to do, a person who has no power, connection or money. All I can do is share my thoughts on the matter and have people notice that some female are not okay with what's being displayed. Look at all the replies on Eurogamer article, there are at least over 500 and 90% are negative, calling Rob a pussy and want him to get sacked for what he wrote. They are focusing on that one aspect he mentioned about Duke Nukem and are not taking the bigger picture and saying how their girlfriends/wifes don't take issues (girls that don't even give a shit about games and love being viewed as objects). It's tiring to deal with such people, having them attack you and don't see where you're coming from.

I respect people like Rob who at least have feelings and think about how females might view it from their perspective, I wouldn't call that playing white knight.

That would be me and... me :-)

Yesterday I was playing the Tomb Raider Trilogy and my wife couldn't help but notice Lara's interesting choice of clothing to climb mountains lol.

Ahaha, didn't notice :P Double thanks to you then :D
Interesting that you mention Lara from Tomb Raider as an example, I actually like that character even though her clothes doesn't make much sense in the context and she had big boobs in the past. I like that the developers reduced her boobs over time and tried to make her more natural. Also, she is at least an intelligent person with a strong personality, she has a character. It is okay to have sexy females (as long as it doesn't go over the top) in games, but not if they serve no purpose except for eye pleasure for the guys.

Ps. but then again, these are just my views and I know it sounds ignorant and as if I know what females gamers want. There a lot of different females who have different views and thoughts about the matter. Female who love being viewed as objects. Sorry if I come over like that.
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« Reply #25 on: April 01, 2011, 08:08:15 AM »

Time to make enemies I guess.

Here's the question. Do women militate against oversexualization in games or about gender equity?

I mean, on one hand, the blog comments how there are very flimsily dressed women in GoW yet forgets about mentioning that Kratos is shirtless and has muscles that put a steroid pumped Arnold Schwarzenegger to shame.

It protests that you can see a female hand near Duke's junk on the cover of DNF yet forgets that Duke's junk is right there in your face.

Also from that blog, why was there a need to protest against a wallpaper saying "Princess Peach is a cocktease" (that includes a fully dressed Peach). What is there to protest against? If you've been going out with a girl that's interested in you and the best you got in 15 years is a kiss on the cheek... I don't think feminism has any say in this.
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« Reply #26 on: April 01, 2011, 08:23:10 AM »

Time to make enemies I guess.

Here's the question. Do women militate against oversexualization in games or about gender equity?

I mean, on one hand, the blog comments how there are very flimsily dressed women in GoW yet forgets about mentioning that Kratos is shirtless and has muscles that put a steroid pumped Arnold Schwarzenegger to shame.

It's about oversexualization in games personally. I hate characters like Kratos with them being macho, shirtless and talk crap like that. I thought those characters were made for males in mind, as this is how they want to feel? Powerful and macho?

Characters like Drake (from Uncharted) and Leon (from Resident Evil 4) are more to my liking and they are portrayed in a neutral way and look more appealing imo. Even Nathan Hale (from Resistance Fall of Man) seems like a good portrayal of character to me (haven't played Resistance 2 yet). He is bald (which is not a bad thing but usually associated with stereotype) but that's about it, he is not acting macho and seems to have some brains.
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« Reply #27 on: April 01, 2011, 08:25:32 AM »

Time to make enemies I guess.



You wont if you don't want to. Fortunately every person on this forum has the ability to express opinions in a respectful manner.
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« Reply #28 on: April 01, 2011, 08:36:50 AM »


That would be me and... me :-)

Yesterday I was playing the Tomb Raider Trilogy and my wife couldn't help but notice Lara's interesting choice of clothing to climb mountains lol.

Ahaha, didn't notice :P Double thanks to you then :D
Interesting that you mention Lara from Tomb Raider as an example, I actually like that character even though her clothes doesn't make much sense in the context and she had big boobs in the past. I like that the developers reduced her boobs over time and tried to make her more natural. Also, she is at least an intelligent person with a strong personality, she has a character. It is okay to have sexy females (as long as it doesn't go over the top) in games, but not if they serve no purpose except for eye pleasure for the guys.

Ps. but then again, these are just my views and I know it sounds ignorant and as if I know what females gamers want. There a lot of different females who have different views and thoughts about the matter. Female who love being viewed as objects. Sorry if I come over like that.


I'm glad you think that way because I agree. She's actually a very good character. She manages to be sexy and classy at the same time. The last 3 games did a great job with her, the voice actress is perfect for the role and Lara comes across as an inteligent, strong and determinated woman.

I love looking at a beautiful woman but I'll take a character like Alix from Half Life or Elena from Uncharted who don't need short skirts or cleavage to make an impression over the semi-naked women with no personality you find in most games.
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« Reply #29 on: April 01, 2011, 08:43:52 AM »

Quote
Time to make enemies I guess.

Here's the question. Do women militate against oversexualization in games or about gender equity?

I mean, on one hand, the blog comments how there are very flimsily dressed women in GoW yet forgets about mentioning that Kratos is shirtless and has muscles that put a steroid pumped Arnold Schwarzenegger to shame.

It protests that you can see a female hand near Duke's junk on the cover of DNF yet forgets that Duke's junk is right there in your face.

You mean the 'Make me a sandwich' blog? I'm not a fan of that one. I think it promotes a very superficial way of what makes a good, interesting female character. It's not about what the female characters do, what their motivations are or anything like that. It's mostly about how much cleavage is or isn't showing. It ignores the fact that women can be proud of their body and want to show it off to some extend. It's not just about being liked by men, it's about being comfortable in your own body.

Besides, if bikinis on the battlefield make sense or not depends on the setting and fighting style used by the character. Many ancient peoples fought their battles practically naked as clothes only got in the way and didn't have the defensive power of a good shield. So, if for instance you decided to make a game about some sort of gender swapped, ancient Greece inspired war game, it'd make sense for the women to wear very light clothing on the battlefield. That doesn't mean they can't be interesting characters. Despite all the evidence found on facebook, wearing a bikini and a personality are not mutual exclusive.

What bothers me are double standards. Unrealistic men in games still have a lot of positive traits. At the very least they're extremely bad-ass. Unrealistic women are mostly there to be sexy, they don't really add anything to the game other than fanservice. Sure, some know how to kick ass, but in the end they still need to be saved by the big strong men. Blargh.
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